Maverick ZINE — Tattoo Culture, Art & Artist Stories

Let's get started, dude. We got uh welcome to support your local tattooer. We got the one and only [ __ ] Phil Luck in the house tonight. He's uh one of my favorite [ __ ] tattooers. And what a [ __ ] artist. What a [ __ ] artist. You [ __ ] are. You're my baby.

My baby boy. Back it up a thousand%. Phil's one of my favorites. And then we got Swarm in the how owner of Hive Tattoo here in Las Vegas, Nevada. Ex-host of the Tattoo Fight Club podcast. Yeah, we need to look those up. Yeah. Tattoo in 25 years.

Uh, November 11th. Wow. Yeah, I remember. You did my 20th for me. That's right. That's right. Yes. On me.

You did one on me, too. I don't remember what anniversary it is. It was one of the anniversaries. It was one of the anniversaries. Analog, remember? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how I remembered that.

I think I did your shark tooth, too. You did my shark tooth as well. I I think I have another tattoo from you as well. I want to say I have three tattoos from you. Did you do Dave Teol's shark tooth? Cuz I saw him the other day and he was didn't even say [ __ ] He just hold out his shark tooth. I can't remember. Nick Bones did it.

I think I don't know why he I feel like he said Nick Bones. Maybe Nick did it. Yeah. Blurry, dude. A lot of that's blurry. I don't know, man. Yeah. I'm excited to hear stories tonight.

We're going to jump in, get down to the, you know, some [ __ ] little little dirty dirty stories. Some old school [ __ ] Yeah, I'm pumped. Um Yeah, dude. So, we just kind of like Phil and I, we we were talking I mean, Phil can talk for himself, too, but we were just throwing around uh the ideas. We just wanted to get to know like your story. You grew up tattooing in Las Vegas in Vegas. So, I guess my story is pretty unique, man. I mean, I I got my start in the Bong Shop, right?

Diversity, the old head shop. You know, I got my piercing apprentichip when I was 19. I got my tattoo apprentichip when I was 20 and that was 2000. And it was just like that little diversity on the corner of Decar and Meadows. And uh that's where Oh, that's the location. Okay. Yeah. See?

Yeah. And then you did you move later on? Yeah. So 2001 I was like cutting my teeth in there and like most of all the good artists, you know, would come through Diversity on the Strip cuz there wasn't anywhere else, right? So a lot of them worked at at Diversity on the Strip and then I moved there in ' 05 and then I had three years of just pure madness tattooing there. Now were you tattooing at the one on Decar or something? I was doing both and then I was doing both on the strip. Yeah.

So I was from 2005 to 2008 I was doing both. I was it was both. And when we say tattooing on the strip, this was way [ __ ] back when there was absolutely no tattoo shops in casinos. Nowhere past that shop nowhere past that shop on the strip. So there was three tattoo shops on that corner of Sahara and Las Vegas Boulevard. Right. And then that was it. So it was Starborn, you guys, and who?

Uh yeah. So, the people who owned Diversity State owned this the shop next door and it was Tattoo Heaven. Yeah. Oh, Tattoo Heaven. Tattoo Heaven and that was way back when um like a lot of those old Pike dudes worked there like Creeper worked there and uh well, he worked across the street. Magic. I think he worked across the street with Cornfed and all them. And then there was like a I don't know, there was like a a wild dude with one tooth, you know?

I don't know. There's some pretty wild. Who was the dude that drove the Porsches? That was Charlie. That was the first time I ever saw a tattooer like make money like that. " So, he actually came from Chicago and I believe he was in the restaurant business. So, I think there's a little backup there, but still But still, he drove like bright Porsches to work every single day. Yeah.

And I was like 22 years old, you know. Was there beef amongst the shops at that point or No, I don't remember there being a lot of beefs among shops back then. I don't I don't Three shops right on top of each other. Yeah. I mean, there might two of them were owned by the same people, right? Right. Yeah. So the people who own Diversity, they own Tattoo Heaven, too.

Or like the sister did. So it's like you walked in one and didn't get the tattoo. You walked in the next one and got the tattoo. You're still getting tattooed. And was there calls? Were you guys calling the other shop like this guy's going to come in type [ __ ] Once in a while there'd be like some [ __ ] people that would come in. So they, you know, there was a back door. You just go the back door and let them know, you know?

So they just go around the back and into the back door. But wild times in the beginning of my tattoo career. Naked City. Hells yeah. Yeah. Cuz there was a few shops down that way, you know. I mean, the very first tattoo shop was still there, but it wasn't owned. It was owned by somebody else.

It was Doc's tattoo shop, and I somebody bought it from him or something, but that building's level two now. The Pawn Stars guys built some stuff over it, right? Yeah. Like a grandma's pizza and all that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's actually a damn good pizza spot in there, too.

Really good pizza. Yeah. I think I had it when I was there downtown for a minute. Yeah. And this neighborhood like when we say on Las Vegas Boulevard at the bottom of the stratosphere tower naked city is at that time especially to I don't know where that accent came from. Real [ __ ] wild. That's where they were filming bum fights. So all the bum fights all the bum fights were filmed down there.

Yeah. The crackhead. Uh they wanted me to do that and I told them no. They wanted me to do the forehead tattoo and I was like and I knew those guys and I I told them nah man I I don't know. I don't want to do that. Those dudes were a trip. Yeah. They asked me to do it.

So I didn't do the forehead tattoo. I think they ended up getting that done in San Diego, but I did Rufus' forearms. Really? Somebody next to you did the Knuckles, right? Yeah. Jesse girl did the Knuckles, which is the most famous ones. Like they use that as a cover of bum fights. Yeah.

And same [ __ ] Like that was like a really early days for us as tattooers. We were in these positions where you didn't say no. So then those dudes came in and they were like, "Hey, got some people. " And I was like, "Okay, well, why can't they speak for themselves? " And you and why do you guys all have video cameras? You know, I mean, NECA City was pretty bad back then, too, man. Like, and you had that What's the hotel behind the shop? Miridor, uh, the El Miridor.

That place is pretty sketchy. One of the tattoo artists had a rattlesnake in that place, man. Dude, I saw a lot of things when I was like way too young to see things like my early 20s were really wild. Like, we're talking about guys that were all like 20 or 25 years older than me and they just making so much money every day, man. And they were just spending it on the dumbest things. Like, oh, you guys were making like like the the dancers, the strippers at that time were making buku bucks and these tattooers were making the same. It was like the same because people would have to like people would stay at the stratosphere and they would have to walk by through the three tattoo shops to get to the strip to like there. I mean, the sidewalk would be packed every every night just with people walking by.

And then you had it mixed in with like all the crackheads from Naked City and all that. So, you got like bling bling and all the homeless ladies and everything walking by with no shirts on. And I had to work on the window. So like every time I'm sitting there tattooing, I'll be like I'm like 20, what am I? 25, 26 years old. And I'm like tattooing, I'm trying to concentrate and there' just be like this wild homeless lady outside the window putting her her bits on the window and pounding on the window. And then every group of drunk sority dudes or whatever, dude. Or sority girls.

And that that was like every week. I mean, it was just groups and groups of like tattooing in a fishbowl. It was it was always tattooing in a fishbowl and it was just groups and groups of just the most wild people. Great. It was great because early 2000 tourism in Vegas was nuts. Boom. So, what got you to that point essentially? What was what was the I want to be a tattooer?

When did that happen? I think I think I wanted to be a tattoo artist when I was young. I think I was really young. I I saw like some National Geographic stuff when I was like 10 or 11, I think. And I would like draw my arms. And then we had a family gathering and there was a a uncle or a guy that was married to my aunt and he had just gotten like this giant wizard on his arm right here. Like a jail house wizard. Like the face with the beard and everything.

And man, I think I was 13. I just thought I was the coolest thing I'd ever seen. It was just like, wow, I want a tattoo, you know? " And they'd laugh at me or Yeah. Riot kid. Finally, I went through like I don't know 15 or 16 guys and finally I got the tattoo apprentichip. Who did you apprentice on? So I started with the Jesse Smith, not the one that everybody knows, but the other Jesse Smith who he literally always referred to himself as the other as the other Jesse Smith.

And then he ended up going to the strip and he was part of the whole movement where all those guys left diversity and opened Heart and Huntington. So, and they were on the show and all that. The first tattoo show he and dude I did my apprentichip with him too and I has some weird stories but uh with Jesse Smith. Oh, cuz you worked in that shop, right? Well, I only started with him like 3 months and he was like, "Oh, man. Sorry. I'm moving to the other shop so I guess you know cuz I had to work there. " And lucky for me, Matt also Smith.

Oh, yeah. Jesus Matt. So, I worked with him, too. " Which You ever met Jesus Matt? I don't think I have. He's a cool dude, man. I've actually gotten back in contact with recently. He He dude, he always comments on my like tattoos, like how proud of, you know, like how proud he's just great.

I'm like, if you're coming back to Vegas, man, I'd love to like sit down and chat with you, man, about the old times. And he was always kind to me, too, when I was doing my apprentichip. Very kind dude. Very nice dude. He lives somewhere, I think, like North one of the Carolinas. dude had straight hair all the way down to his butt. Like he's a big dude. Yeah, he's a big guy.

And where is he at now? Where is he tattooed now? In the Carolinas. Okay. North or South or something. I see him like post a thing or two here and there. Yeah. So So we said we we talked sometimes which is cool.

I think that's when I asked you. I think I I got with you on Instagram about like the three names that he told me he learned from and you were like I think I know one of them or something like that. So I was trying to trace it back as far as I can, you know, lineage. Yeah. Yeah. I actually have a tattoo apprentice. It's really weird. Yeah.

I never thought I would have a tattoo apprentice ever, but I found this kid that knows people that I know and he's really super nice and so far he's doing great. Oh, nice. It's only like third months, but everything's clean. Toilets are clean, dude. Like, you know, things are tattoo. My first tattoo apprentice, I had a body piercing apprentice, and she is just absolutely killing it. Yeah. It's She's doing amazing.

And she's still with you at Hodge. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She's I kind of made her like the manager cuz she like puts it down for me, you know? Yeah, piercing is crazy right now. I know.

I We get calls every day. We send them over to you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. And her bedside manner and like I painted the whole room like pink for her. So very her, you know, and she's just like she's got this slew of people coming in, man. They love her.

I love her. She's great, man. Yeah. Yeah. So speaking of piercing, like um so back in the day it was like when piercers wanted to get into tattooing, do you remember how resistant like and sour [ __ ] tattooers were? They did not want to hear. All I did was get picked on. That's it, man.

And of course, you know, I'm like 19, 20 years old. I got like my whole face is full of metal. You know, I got piercings everywhere, you know. Back then, we were even like sterilizing paper towels and like wearing masks before anybody like wore, you know, it's I don't want to use the word goofy, but when I look back on it, it feels a little weird to me. I was a young kid, but then everybody's picking on us always. Oh, oh man, you're just the piercer. Oh man, hey, turn that music off or I'm going to punch you. You know, like which that happened one time like a lot.

Like I remember that it was almost like the piercers they would be treated like the the [ __ ] apprentices. Oh yeah. Oh the shop rat had a better chance of getting through. Yeah. For sure. 100%. Yeah. It was crazy like the piercers were making like as much money as these guys too and it was like all right well whatever bro.

That was like our ear our early like um ex I don't know exposure to like how sour tattooers can be like the older tattooers can be. I I mean they they were really sour back then. Super well and physical. Like they would get to the point where they were physical with you every time. I got punched in the leg. I got like manhandled. I got like thrown outside of the shop. Like and you didn't go like cry to somebody about it, dude.

You like you didn't say anything about it. You didn't like go to the boss and be like me, you know? Like it's like you just dealt with it, you know? You just dealt with what happened. I think it was because uh I mean for my case like I I I wasn't going through that as dramatic but I was just [ __ ] in love with tattooing and I and that was how you got into it. There was no other way, right? So you just dealt with the craziness and the whatever. I just feel like you wanted to do it so bad back then.

So you would just put up with Absolutely. 100%. Whatever it It's definitely not the same anymore. It seems like people put up with a lot less, but like we put up with a lot. Like when Nick's kid was apprenticing, like we'd be telling him stories. " But like there's a lot different back then. I wonder about that a lot. Would this current generation be able to make it through the [ __ ] that we went?

Also, let's not forget we went through a severe apprenticeship. Apprenticeships these days are so quick. There's nothing to learn. You know, like I talk about that all the time. I had to learn this, this, this, this, this, and this. And these days, all you got to do is just focus on learning to tattoo. So I mean the the duration of an apprenticeship is a fraction of what it was when we started, you know. Well, and you got so much information, right, these days it's like, yeah, you have access to it.

So why would you put up with that [ __ ] You can see things that we would have put up with that [ __ ] if if we would have had access now. And that's the thing is we had to deal with the gatekeepers because they had that information. These days when I hear about, oh, the gatekeepers, the gatekeepers, it's like what what are you dealing with gatekeepers for? You got you got YouTube right there. Like what do you need their information? You could become a master. I mean, there's a kid on there like breaking down every tattoo he did for a week and how much he charged and how much he got paid and you're like, "Oh, that's weird. What?

Why? " The the amount of money thing is weird, but that's like a a generational thing on social media. They share how much money they make. And like I was always taught you don't [ __ ] Oh, I watch tattooers legitimately counting their money on Instagram these days. And I'm just like, "Bro, you're the first guy I'm robbing. " No, I know you didn't learn from all these poor rock rappers that got [ __ ] shot in public cuz they showing their money back and everything. Oh, there's just some things you just don't share, you know? There's some things you just keep to yourself, you know?

But but you're right. It might be a generational thing. I'm not going to let these girls do that though, man. I'll be following them on Instagram, you know? You grow up learning that that's the way you do it. So, it's just natural. Yeah. What a trip, huh?

Yeah. Yeah. But it is a good point though. Like I like you and I definitely we all wouldn't have done what we went through, I think, if there was an option. I mean, I still love it, man. I don't care how many people do it. Well, let me ask you this. Yeah.

If you if you were an 18-year-old Jay Swam now, would this been interest would this business even be interesting to you? I'm not sure cuz I, you know, I didn't really like have Instagram or anything. Like, I picked what I wanted to do and I just stuck with it. Yeah. I didn't have any like all these options. So, who knows? I I I really don't know. Probably cuz I was like just really into it.

And I feel like there are kids now that are getting tattoos and they're really into it. And honestly, we're getting to the age now where it's like, bro, a couple years I'm going to be 50. You know, how much longer I can tattoo until the end, but like am I going to be tattooing like I used to be tattooing? Am I going to be doing four or five tattoos a day? It's not going to happen, man. Right. Getting older. Can't lean over, right?

Starting to not be able to see that. Great. You know, you see good, but it's not like it's like it's you're getting older. You're feeling You're feeling your age. I'm feeling mine. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So, I saw like all the fine line stuff come in and I [ __ ] struggled with it because I physically couldn't accomplish it because I couldn't see really good. The boys over here. I just got some new glasses so I can get readers built in. What do you call the the tri focal things? You got that going on? Well, not these yet, but I just got the call. They're due. I pick them up tomorrow.

Yeah. So, maybe my fine line career will take off, you know? Like maybe I can get in there and start crushing it. You have a thing like Rick Morannis and like honey I struck the kids, you know, magnifying glasses. That's it. That's it. I do this. I can see the edge of that needle so good, man.

Don't worry about that. But I guess it's like comes to time at like a age where it's like I you got to start passing a little bit on, you know? You got to start being nice to the kids, man. They'll be nice to you and they're 20 years down the line. Hope hopefully, you know. Dude, so back back to like the crazy [ __ ] at that shop. Like dude, there was also some sketchy sketchy vibes there, right? I mean I mean there were sketchy artists, man.

There was dudes that like I said, there was a dude that came from somewhere. He had one tooth, man. Guy had one tooth. Had the the cigarettes in his thing right here. He was a tattoo artist. I was like 20. I was terrified of this dude, man. And he had the marks, you know, like from whatever year they used to still test the tattoo.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay. from checking testing new inks, testing colors or testing them before he lay into somebody. So they like make sure it went in good. Okay, I'm ready to go. I don't know if I've ever seen that in person. I have friends who would would test on their hands and then they still have, you know, just lines down their hands.

Whoa. This guy had them from, I would say, like here to about here. He had like a a section of dots. Man, I wish I could remember his name, but he seriously had one tooth, dude. like just one front tooth, but a lot of tattoos. I made up for it. A lot of crazy tattoos. And I I wish when I was younger, I thought about taking pictures of some of these guys' tattoos.

And now when I look back on it, I totally wish I would have just so I could have I wish I would have taken more pictures. I bet. Yeah. Period. Yeah. " And they're right. Well, that's the beauty of these days. I mean like when I when I started you were still using you still have to bring your film to the you know so I mean you take a hundred pictures of a tattoo you go to develop them and find out you ain't got no pictures of that tattoo or you maybe get one out of a roll and you're like well this is worth would be like on one side but you could get it clear here so I'd cut the picture down the middle and then put the tattoo together so you could get the non-glare parts out and I remember making like I don't know.

It's like a [ __ ] layered film, you know, like layered pictures in your portfolio. Yep. Cuz I was like, it's just too easy. Like all different sizes, right? Like glue them in there. Yeah. It was like craft crafting. Yeah.

I always remember like taking pictures of like a really nice tattoo and then like getting the pictures and being like, "Well, I'll never get to see that tattoo. " Walk through or come through again. True story. But yeah, it was crazy back then. And it was crazy down there. And I'm sure all those tattoo artists that work down there all have crazy stories, you know. Well, the the prostitution thing was huge here, dude. It was real crazy.

Like I remember, you know, when you're really young, you come in and you can't turn down the tattoo or your boss is going to tell you to I could never turn down a tattoo. Especially where I was at, dude. No way, bro. Those they they'd be real bad if people How many people you think were in that shop on the strip? Oh, we we had u Okay, so there's five stations, two shifts. So there was or six maybe there was between 10 and 12 tattoo artists and then there was three piercers and the these guys all tattooed man I mean there would be days where like five guys would all do like five to six tattoos a piece. Yeah. And they were pulling like two grand a day.

Yeah. I can't remember the exact numbers man but people had money. I mean they had hobbies. I remember you specifically telling me that you you had like at one point in time at the peak of your awesomeness or young awesomeness was you make 2500 and you spend all of it usually all of it because this is how it would go. m. We would I mean we'd be partying all night, right? We'd be drinking beers and people were doing [ __ ] out of their tool boxes, man. Like and they were doing it with their clients.

" go to the strip club until I don't know some god awful hour like the sun's coming up. Go home for three hours. Once in a while there'd be like an afterparty thing you'd go to. The sun would be up and then there'd be like this pool thing you'd go to for a little while. Go home, take a nap, go back in the shift, do it again. Three or four days in a row. That's why I say I can't like really remember my 20s, man. It was It calmed down right when I came to work for you.

That's what it was like coming off. I remember like in the story. Yeah, there was structure at 21 and it was it was nice. It was good for all of us. All of us. All of us. And we even had a great time, you know, like we had a blast. Blast.

We had our nights of drinking and stuff like that. But but yeah, I I like that's why I was looking to get out of there cuz it was just too nuts. I mean, I remember, you know, you brought a prostitution. m. and he brings three of his prostitutes with him and he's the pimp, hands down. You know, he is. " And I'm like, "All right, man. " However much it was, 100, 150 bucks a piece.

I get to the last girl and I'm tattooing her. And she's balling her eyes out, man. And I'm like sitting there doing this tattoo. I'm like, "Hey, uh, you you okay? " I look up at the dude. " I was like, "Okay, bro. " You know, and just finish. But that was definitely like one of those times that really bummed you out.

Bummed me out. It stuck out to me. And I was like one of those times where I was like, "I got to get the [ __ ] out of here, man. It's it's time to get out of here. You know, even in our first shop, dude, we were right there off of the the strip, you know, running parallel. And that was like the cab drivers run. And uh it was it was pretty sketch, dude. Like a like a a lot of really uncomfortable moments in that shop at night with guys that come in and they are very just straight gangsters, dude.

Like the real real deal. And they're just like, I want this done right now. You're like, you haven't had anybody walk in in [ __ ] like all day. " Um, just you're just trying to do a good job and then they're standing right over you and they're some of the most intimidating [ __ ] I ever met in my whole life. Scary, man. We had the drunk people all the time at Diversity. You know, I have whatever this guy's name from, we'll just say Ohio. So, we're talking about Ohio and he'd be like whatever 26 beers deep and man, I want a picture of my wife's ass tattooed right here, right on my arm.

And you're just like, "All right, dude. " Yeah. This town is not known for good decisions. That's That's the issue. " But Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was have a tattoo till the sun came up.

m. finally get to leave, you know? Feel like you learned a lot about life in general about that because I feel just growing up in Vegas and then working on the strip. I think I learned a lot more than a lot of people do. Yeah. It's just meeting so many different people from so many different uh you know lifestyles and everyone comes to Vegas, you know, everyone comes to Vegas and intoxication levels and you're trying to control the situation, but it's kind of more or less like you're just trying to keep it [ __ ] alive and like I just need to get this job done and you guys I don't know how many times you had it happen to where you had two people that are just like in a crazy brutal fight and then they're getting each other's names tattooed on each other and They're drunk and angry at each other and and you're convinced you're going to do a cover up as soon as you're done doing the name.

Yeah. " And you're like, "Get them in, get them out. " I'm over there trying to like make it fancy because I really want to learn my script. " And I feel like you learn how to pick and choose your battles, you know? Like you're in this tough ass situation. Heaven forbid you spell the [ __ ] name wrong. Yeah, dude. Oh, dude.

That's a whole other section of talking about like and I was working with older dudes too when I got brought down to the strip and you know I'd see them just bang out a quick name you know not take any time and I'd do the same thing. I'd sit there and draw it and they come over and be like, "Dude, why are you wasting your time? Just print that [ __ ] out. " You know, that reminds me of another story. I had a couple uh one night. It was like 11 or 12:00 at night and this couple comes in and they're like, "Hey, we just met each other at the nightclub last night. We're like in love. " And I'm tattooing this girl, this dude's name, and she's like calling her family like, "I'm at the love of my life.

" And this guy's just sitting in the corner just smiling at me. And I'm like, I dude, this is this is too much, bro. This is too much. I was like, "Are you guys sure you don't want to get these tattooed in color? Pink. " Yeah. When you're working with those kind of people and on the strip, it's two questions only, dude. Yeah.

Well, I think what do you want? Do you got money? The other big issue is the fact that when when people come to Vegas, they genuinely believe what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. So, I feel like when people come here, they act extra stupid. Yeah. You know, so yeah, working in a tourist spot like that had to have been absolute [ __ ] murder because you're not just dealing with the local idiots. You're dealing with idiots being shipped in from everywhere. Madness.

And they and they used to make them pay for the tattoos up front. So that was Yeah, because there was so many issues. Yeah, there was so many issues. " And then, you know, it's 300 bucks and you got to go sit there and wait until he's done with his three tattoos before you. It just be like a whole bunch of people and they're already paid off at that point. " Like, uh, obviously. Yeah. Do whatever you want.

But that puts so much more pressure on you. Like, if I'm knowing that there's three heads that already paid for the tattoos that I have to do in the next couple hours, that's pressure, dude. I wouldn't eat, dude. We wouldn't eat. Like, we just eat later. You wouldn't do anything. You just just sit there, clean up, set up, do it again, clean up. And we had towards the end we started like having people help there where they like clean up and set up for you.

And then you obviously have to tip them out and stuff. So that that became a little more helpful like when you were three to five people deep, you know? Yeah. Can you at least bring in like a half of a just something real quick? I'll eat in the bathroom, you know? I don't even care cuz there's no no not like a break room or like a drawing room or anything crazy like that, you know? Yeah. This is all preiad obviously.

So we're just looking way preipad. We didn't get an iPad till 2010, right? I don't know. But was it later than that? Yeah, I think later than that. I think it was later than that. " Yeah, that's right. I'm drawing on this.

I was like like on the like on the computers, you know, like this little flat computer. It took us by storm when we were all together. I love it. As soon as I touched that thing, I was like, "Oh, yeah. " Yeah. Yeah. I still haven't figured it out. I expect that from you.

I expect that from you, Phil. I love mine every day. I like I won't even leave it in my backpack in the car. Like, dude, if I go to the grocery store, I'm like taking my backpack. Also from the '9s. You don't leave your CDs in your car either. No. No.

You know, it's funny. Mimi just got a car. It has a CD player in it. Yeah. Uncle Joey gave her a car, you know. Oh, that's cool. So, we've gone last week. Get it registered and we've been every week anyway.

She's got a permit. She's got a permit, dude. Oh, yeah. So he gave her a car. Sick uncle move, but it's got a CD player. " I'm going to give you this rack of CDs. " I'm like, "Just listen to them. " Yeah, exactly.

Like you might like something in there. Watch one get stuck in there. My sister had a Bruce Springsteen [ __ ] album stuck in her Malibu. I don't know if it was Bruce Springsteen. No, it was uh was it the Red Hot Chili Peppers? I think it was the Red Hot Chili Peppers. I'm pretty sure it was just stuck in there and it would just play. Sorry, Courtney.

You'll have to She'll have to She'll have to fix us on that one. But the Boo. Yeah, the Malibu. Yeah, I believe it was Red Hot Chili Peppers that was stuck in there. I remember her telling me that. That's That's pretty funny, man. Did you have any other jobs before you got into like the piercing thing? Just kid jobs.

Like just like I worked at Bonnie Springs, Old Nevada when I was like 15 and a half. Remember this? Yeah. Yeah. I used to cowboy on the weekends up there and like run the the wax. That had to have been a [ __ ] blast. It was cool cuz the cowboys would call me, you know, they were drunk up there, those cowboys up there and they call you out and shoot you on the thing. So that was like cool.

I did that on the weekends and I worked at like the Meadows Pet Store. Okay. And uh You never worked at Mr. Rags? I don't know why. For some reason, I felt like I did like I worked at Mr. Rags. Yeah.

No, no, just the Meadows Pet store. And then um I had the best summer of my life when I was 17. I got to be a lifeguard at Wet N Wild. Awesome. It was the best summer of my life, dude. I still say that to this day. You know, those are like badass jobs. Like the kids that were young and that had were in that position were like the badass.

It was a 1996 or 1997. Yeah. I wasn't going to take my shirt off, so I wouldn't take I didn't care, man. I didn't care. I would just stand there. What was that like raging rapids or whatever it was where they came down the tube and was in the pool and I would just be standing there like with my sun block, my stupid hat on. I just like pushing girls by in tube. I'm like this is the greatest day ever, you know, 17, you know.

And then I think I worked at U-Haul for like a short stint. Oh, I did work at the movie theater for like a quick minute at the the two movie theater at the Gold Coast. Okay. My dad was a foreman at the Gold Coast. So, you kind of had regular jobs though before you got into the industry. So, were you like a more responsible? Definitely, dude. Yeah.

I never called in or anything. I mean, I feel like I had pretty good work ethic when I worked for you. Yeah. You know, so I think I always had a good work ethic. God, I can't talk. Work two sips of wine. Okay. Um a work ethic.

Even when I was young, man, I always showed up. Um, people asked me to work. I see a lot of it in my daughter now. She's she gets like upset if she can't like cover for somebody. She's like really responsible. I'm like, man, I was just like that, you know? I was always just showed up, you know? You just Yeah.

You I mean, you're just genuinely a good dude. Oh, thanks, buddy. I appreciate that. You always like follow through. Yeah. Yeah. Treat people good. You'll be treated good.

That's how it always worked out for me. Yeah. Even when dudes were punching me in the leg and Yeah. treating me like [ __ ] With kindness, man. Just killed him with kindness, man. Like, still showed up the next day. [ __ ] him with a smile. Yeah.

You're not going to scare me so bad out of this gig that I'm not coming back tomorrow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that's that heart and that determination and drive that I think, you know, got you through it. And I think that's what gets a lot of tattoo art, maybe all three of us, you know, any tattooers that actually want to be a tattooer. You will become a tattooer. Will you be good at it?

You don't know. Probably. Hopefully. What's crazy is you don't even have to be that good if you just show up and be kind. I'll say it a thousand times to this day. I would rather get a a mediocre tattoo from a nice guy than a beautiful tattoo from an [ __ ] that's wearing headphones. [ __ ] that, dude. Are you kidding me?

Experience. It's all in the experience. And that's what blows my mind when I ask a customer with a beautiful tattoo. " And it's like, "You missed the whole [ __ ] point. It was all in the experience. What do you mean some guy? " I know. I I became so dude still to this day so many of the people that I speak to on a regular basis that uh like a big part of my life are people that I met through tattoos.

Everybody all my friends all the greatest people I know I met them they sat in my chair at one point. Yeah. Very rare I have like a few people that didn't come and get tattooed but like I'll be at a gathering with all my friends and I just look around like wow I did that tattoo that tattoo that tattoo. I I mean I even you just sitting down right here. " We spent a lot of time together, man. Me and you used to hang out a lot, man. So, um yeah, I tattooing is magical, though. There's still days that I tattooed today that like it's magical, man.

I went in, I hung out with two people that I think are cool as [ __ ] I I did my best that I could do for you, the brightest colors, the cleanest lines, whatever that I can give to you. We had a great conversation and I went home and I can pay bills, man. It's it's really it's really a cool job, you know. It's really a it's a it's a ma, like you said, it's a magical thing, man. Tattooing. I I still I still feel it on the daily when I do it, you know? Just basic gratitude, dude. You know, just wake up and be It still blows my mind that these things stay, you know?

Like I'm still caught on that. Like to me like when when I first got into tattoos I was like but it stays like and that's still amazing to me. Yeah. Unless you use the wrong black. I disappearing tattoo. I don't know how the [ __ ] it happened but you were there with me, right? Like brawash story, right? Yeah.

I [ __ ] did a full week of tattooing and it I don't know what the [ __ ] I I I remember this up enough or something like 25 years and all was it was a pre-cut gray. I think I don't [ __ ] I feel like we were trying something new or something or or it was like at the time maybe there I do feel like this was happening the there was uh sketchy tattoo supplier guys coming around that were getting their [ __ ] sketchy places that were labeled as say dynamic but I don't think it was dynamic but it it [ __ ] looked black like I when you were putting it in it felt natural black it felt right I I didn't even notice. " And I did this [ __ ] thing from neck to butt cheeky, like a spine tattoo. I remember this tattoo. Yeah. Yeah. So then I was mortified, dude.

" The heart starts racing. Oh my god. " And then I was just stopped everything. thing. And this is like I was booked out like eight months in advance, you know, like five days a week, dude. And I literally had to just straight halt the train, call all those people in, ask them about their tattoo, can you please come by? Can I look at your tattoo? And even like some of them just didn't even think anything of it.

And I was like, um, just so you were clear, like, yeah, I [ __ ] like I don't want to say I [ __ ] it up, but I [ __ ] it I'm going to take responsibility for this and I will fully like unfortunately redo your tattoo on your ribs or whatever. That sounds horrible, dude. I I don't even think you redid all of them. I think some people just never even came back. I know. I kept trying and like a week or something. I remember that. Scared and I just remember that just now.

Like I totally forgot about Oh, that's the worst feeling though. There were some sketchy ass suppliers in Vegas back then. There was so many. I just don't understand how I miss how I didn't like see it, you know? how I I it was at the peak of my business ever, but I I don't know. I don't think that's a mistake. Dark gray can look black, you know? It must have just been something in the bottle or who knows, man.

But that mortified, dude, messing up any tattoo or spelling something wrong or put some on something on upside down, tears off your life. And when you realize it, man, your heart is in your stomach. Yeah. And you do not sleep that night. It's just because you just try so hard for those things not to happen. But yeah, you're human. Things happen. Like stuff does happen.

That's why it's check it three times with spelling anymore and it's like look at it again, look at it again. Oh, is this your nation's flag? Make sure it's all I want everybody in the room to spell check that [ __ ] you know? Like every [ __ ] word. I literally remember doing that. Like after I did it one time, I spelled bot B. I can't even spell it still, but I spelled it wrong. And luckily it was easy fix.

I made the U into an A, like a lowercase A. But I had a dude spell his own daughter's name wrong one time. I've had that as well. I've had that as well. And then he tried to blame me. " I actually had his wife come in flipping [ __ ] And thank God at that point we were doing so many names that we keep a book. They'd have to write down the name. " And I'm like, and she's going bananas.

" And I was like, "Before you say a word, outside. You ain't beating his ass in the waiting room. " On top of it, maybe you should have given your baby a name that was [ __ ] spellable. You know, that's what I said. Cuz at that point, I was like, "You came at me. " You know, dude, I second guessed my own daughter's name. My wife named her. So, and I was like I was still Eloise is L O U I S.

And I remember like before I had kids, this dude being like, "Hold on, hold on one second, bud. " Like in my head like judging him. " O, you Yeah. Our youngest daughter's middle name is Quinn, but it's it's Vietnamese, right? So it's qu y, you know, I think I think that's right. " So, I can understand I can totally understand that. Yeah. So, Phil and I were talking too earlier about like um your style, the style that you developed with um when you had that color palette.

Yeah. Like with the the red and the the gray and the yellow brown. Yeah. Really gone back and used. Yeah. Yeah. Really gone back to that. There was like a minute there I kind of like you veered off.

I had a weird time in my life not too long ago, man. I went through a thing, you know, and I think everybody does, you know, and there was a time where I was, you know, sitting outside your shop with everything I owned and I didn't have a job and I didn't have a place to live. I had moved out of that girlfriend's house I had and I didn't know what I was going to do, man. So, um, when I went to work in downtown, I just started doing more traditional tattoos and kind of fell off that. But I've really gone back to what I like, like just movies. I meant like the record I just just Yeah, it was awesome. I just photographed it yesterday. Yeah, I that's I just love it.

I just I felt like you were really on to something with that. Yeah, I think I I loved it. I felt like it was you. It was like I mean you came from like more new school when you started with us and then you you started really developing this like love for uh traditional. Yeah, I give that to Phil. Phil Phil showed me all of that, man. You know, like then like Phil Yeah. But you developed your own unique touch and style and color like you said.

It was very few That's the thing. There's very few traditional text. Yeah. There's one up there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So, it's like the the brown the like the deep like the brown red. There's few things you can do in traditional to set yourself apart. Like what can you possibly do? And I feel like there's only a hand handful of tattooers that I've seen pull it off. I really appreciate that like cuz that drives me crazy to see the same thing over and over. I know. Yeah. And like I see I even have like newer tattooers in my shop and they're just doing the same thing, man.

" Like, "Okay, you're into hockey, man. " They're like, "I was into movies, right? I'm still into movies. " '90s pop culture that you put into it. It was so good. Yeah, I love that. I I still have a list that I need to do. It's just about finding time to do it, running a shop, raising kids.

I get those 10 minutes or 20 minutes. to get my iPad. I'm sitting at the table. " So, it's it's pretty it's pretty neat to like throw it together really really fast, you know? Yeah. I appreciate that. No, I watched it happen, dude. I watched you build out like your whole entire wall with the grid and then buy the frames.

We installed them all blank and then you just slowly started filling them in, which was a fun like it was like a mission that looked you in the eyes every single day. You needed to call it the wall of doom. Yeah. The wall of doom. The wall of doom. Because it was empty, right? It had one. It had one or two in there.

And I was like, I'm gonna fill these all. And it took me two years almost to the day. Took me two years almost to the day to fill that wall. Yeah. Cuz I felt like one took a couple of months. Of course, no iPad putting the drawing together. So, it was always like a mission to get that flash sheet together. And that wall was beautiful.

Yeah. You got to come by the shop. We got a bunch of them now. You got to come come check out the shop, dude. I'm about to build two more walls in the shop, you know, have like the half-traditional thing going, but still leave enough room for people to be unique and do their own. I mean, I have one guy that does like realism and he all he does is tattoo fake skin for his art. Yeah. And it's it's crazy, man.

It's so sick. It's like insane. It's beautiful. And he frames them. And I'm like, that is just such a cool thing. I'm like glad you're doing something. Yeah. The last art show I came into your shop, I was like you you showed me that.

I was like, I don't know. I never even seen anything like that before. I don't even That's so crazy. Pretty wild. Yeah. And And I love how like he's using his time, his downtime like you were. You're using your down time to tattoo or to produce, you know, and that's uh I don't know. I just always I love those days where we were all together and every singing the second we weren't tattooing, we were painting.

remember we would pull out our paint stuff on purpose because every time you would pull it out and set it up get a walk in tattoo and it was like we would do it, you know, when you get ready to paint or when you get ready to tattoo a friend, someone walks through the door immediately. Y those were really great years, man. I really I think about those years constantly. I really think about those years constantly, man. And how like they helped me become who who I am, you know? They they really did. And and I'll even throw it out there like you and like your parents help show me like how to be a dude and like be a dad and like decorate my own space. You don't like something, man, throw some shelves up, you know, and like make it your own.

Like I never had that like growing up. It was always like crappy apartments that nobody like did anything. So like they I really learned a lot in in those years. You know what I mean? Like it like learning how to you know be a dad, be a dude. And then of course, like you guys brought up, like just how about the fact that we all got along so well. Like that's so we were [ __ ] legit family. Like we look I looked forward to seeing you guys every day, you know?

That's so rare in a tattoo shop. It never felt like going to work. It was like I can't wait to get there today, you know? Yeah. Yeah. That was a great crow. Yeah. Yeah.

It was a good time, too. Yeah. It's a It's a difficult thing to build, you know. It took like I think I was thinking about it the other day. I was like I think it took me like 15 years to get to the point to where I had a decent group of people. Yeah. Like a good good like solid group. Yeah.

I've been through a few now. Like I totally I understand now. It really takes a lot to put the right people together. A lot of patience and burying your pride at times. Uh keeping your mouth shut and just trying to get [ __ ] like keep the [ __ ] machine moving, you know, like and not let your emotions get in there. That's the thing right there. It's like you got to really take your time and be um like a owner and a boss. You can't can't get your feelings involved like, "Hey man, I love you to death, dude, but I have to do this, you know, or like I have to hire this person or I have to have this next person come in because I can't keep it the same like this because this is not working for for me.

It's not a good partnership, you know. " Cheers. Yeah. Cheers. That's why I grab the bottle for you. Got to get Phil. You got to bring Phil by. Bring him by, man.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It it's it was a is it's a very important thing. Uh you know, the the vibe in your shop and who you bring in. Um and it's not [ __ ] easy, dude. And it's it's the hands down hardest thing I've ever done.

And it's been incredibly rewarding, but incredibly asskicking and embarrassing and humbling and [ __ ] like I'm Yeah, I'm not going to lie. I spent like time and I was doing that [ __ ] too when I was like 22 and I had a hot head ass dad that I needed to always try to keep out of the [ __ ] conversation with people, you know, and like and try to keep us like that would have been hard, man. That that would have been really difficult for me because I wouldn't be able to It's good. It's just me because then I make the decision. Totally. You know what I mean? And and then it's done. I don't have to partnerships and everything like dude, we did a whole episode about partnerships and partnerships with your family are two completely different animals, too.

That's true. True. You can't fire your parents. Yeah, we learned that for years. And everybody always thought that I was the kid that uh just worked at my parents' tattoo shop. I've actually heard that a few times later. I always tell people I always correct people. Somebody said it to me the other day.

I'm like, "No, no, that's not how it work. " And then at the bottom and their son works there, too. Awesome. Yeah. You're like, I [ __ ] what the [ __ ] And know and and it bothered me at the beginning and then it's just it's like talk about like swallowing your pride and like [ __ ] ego. You just got to just keep moving, dude, and just keep doing like whatever. I don't really care what the [ __ ] you think. Like I was trying to teach my kid this the other day.

It's like the sooner you can get over being concerned what anybody else around you [ __ ] thinks, then life is so much easier. And that doesn't mean you're a bad person. You know, you're just you can't take into consideration everyone's [ __ ] opinion. You know, apply that to tattooing, too. Yeah. I don't care what a group of tattoo artists think about my tattoos. No, you can't. We we I think we all set out to impress specific tattooers.

Yeah. You know, and any anyone past that really didn't didn't show up on our radars. Yeah. You know, and sometimes you meet those people and then your your outlook changes unfortunately, you know, and like how many times have you met a hero or somebody you looked up to and they were just shitty to you and you're just like, "All right, you know what, man? That's cool. " You know, I don't it's all good. I've been getting this far by myself. I've been getting this far alone.

I'm doing just fine for myself. You know, we were talking too about how, you know, you were going through a lot of [ __ ] at the time and you ended up out on outside and I um and you you had broke up with that girl, you know, and like to me like the most important healthy thing in my life that I've ever ever experienced is having the right partner. Oh man, it is so huge. It's so incredibly important. It is huge. I mean, I wouldn't I don't think I would have opened my shop without Jen, like without my wife. She's like a backbone, man. Kicks my ass.

tells you [ __ ] do that. Do that, man. What are you scared of? What's the worst that can happen that you're in the same place that you're in today? So that's it's I think having a partner that backs you up is so super important in in any in a healthy manner, you know, healthy manner. " I don't want to dodge any more like milk jugs or anything. You know what I mean? Yeah.

both sides. Both sides, man. Oh, boy. Like, I don't know. I just feel like uh I feel like all three of us are in a really good position right now, you know? It's like having a level-headed human around you and that can help you through those difficult times. Like when dude, when I was younger, like I would literally just go home either to a crazy girlfriend or a girlfriend that was crazy and not home like I don't know where you're at or or at 4:00 or 5 in the morning like, "Hey, where you been? " Yeah.

or just like go home by yourself after that rough ass day where you just do not understand how to communicate with these people and you do not understand how to get people on board or or why are they so awful and like or is it me you know and you I just dude I literally remember sitting on the edge of my bed as a grown ass man just like [ __ ] crying like not telling a soul and then going back into work in the morning like hi all right everybody let's do it come on guys you know and then someone walks in right past you and doesn't say [ __ ] hi and doesn't have really good at that too. Like you got to you got to put on that face for every tattoo, you know? So I feel like we we we were really good at being, you know, [ __ ] about what what what we were going through, you know, and we were professionals at doing that [ __ ] because we Yeah.

We took pride in giving that experience and getting to know those people was just as important as doing the best [ __ ] tattoo you possibly can. Every time. Yeah. Every time. That's that's part of it is just getting to know people and like putting that face on and how how are you today? Like what do you do for work? Like you know, hey, you got big plans for the weekend. You know, I'm I'm about to hurt you.

This is going to suck. I'm sorry, but like let's try to get through this together. You try to make them laugh or whatever. And like tell them some jokes, tell them the worst story, worst tattoo you ever did. " You know, or they love it. Yeah. Yeah. Or like the worst tattoo I ever saw get done was I think I told you guys before, but the seven dwarfs shoveling [ __ ] from a guy's [ __ ] You know, wheelbarrows and gas masks.

This guy came in. He came in and asked and they asked me to do it and I was like, "I'm about to leave. " I tell that story about that tattoo uh weekly. weekly. This gu was dead set. He must have like won a bunch of money while he was in Vegas or something and he was just like, "Today's the day. I'm going to get that tattoo. I've been telling everybody.

" All seven of them, dude. All seven of them. What a almost the inside almost all the way to the outside, dude. Wow. Gas mask and all. Like just shovely smelly [ __ ] Like I remember so many of Phil's [ __ ] up tattoo stories, but for some reason right now I don't have any that pop into my head about you. Oh, I got Do you remember any about me? Uh, I just remember like one like when we were at the shop like the one that like gave you a meltdown was like one of those Jesus tattoo things.

Oh yeah. Like the perspective one. Uh oh yeah. Yeah. I remember that day for some some reason. I remember that day. I think Joey brings that up a lot. Yeah.

Yeah. I didn't want to do it at all. " So he, you know, it was one of those [ __ ] ass crazy ones. It's like Jesus on the cross and his hand is the [ __ ] other hand. And then I had to draw I do remember cuz Joey and I like I don't know. I just remember being just distraught about it. Not like at anybody other than myself because I kind of got I don't know. I pressured myself into doing it or whatever and then I did it and I just [ __ ] I don't know it just didn't I I thought it was going to turn out good and I put my all into it and I was like kind of excited about it but kind of hated it all at the same time.

Mind you, I I felt like the tattoo was fine. It was passable. You just tell he was like what? Not into it. You know, I'm pretty sure you got done and the guy like had some stipulations about it or something like that. thought he was like didn't like it or something and then we were just like yeah and I'm like it's a [ __ ] pencil like I drew the drawing and I put it on you. I mean I wanted to just be like the [ __ ] idea is terrible bro. It's like one of those meme tattoos and like why are you doing this but and I just I didn't execute it well.

I remember a customer that used to drive you up a wall and I remember one day you were like that's it. I'm gonna give it to him this time and what are you gonna do? " And you felt terrible before, during, and after about it. " And he pulls his sleeve up and I'm like, "That's him. " You know who it was? I think I think Yeah, it was the Disney tattoos. Yeah, it was that guy, wasn't it? Yeah, he was like he was a [ __ ] bully and like he was like a real consistent good client, but he was also like I'm so consistent and I'm so good that you need to do this for me.

And he was just very like abrasive and I was just I think yeah, I finally remember breaking up with him like and it wasn't like No, you had to break up with him and when I called it out I was like those are Austin Spencer tattoos. He was like how'd you know that? And I was like I ain't saying another word. I ain't saying another word. He was [ __ ] massive. Big dude. Big dude. Yeah.

Yeah. You see Austin's tattoo from across the room, though. " You know what I mean? I spotted one across an amusement park. When I left Studio 21 and moved to Pennsylvania, I was like I was blown away at how few good tattoos I saw in Pennsylvania. And we were at this place um can't even remember the name of the amusement park and there was a woman with this beautiful tattoo. She was good 30 40 feet away. " It must have been a bunch of teal in it.

Feels like tons of blues. Tons of blues that were just solid. Light blue. Just solid, bro. It's perfect. Yeah. Why was that? Like that became my thing for like 20 [ __ ] years.

It was Nobody else can do it. Everybody just wanted it. We could try. Nobody else can do it. Blue. That's the truth. Yeah. Yeah.

I struggled with blue for a long time. I still I hate blue, dude. I hate blue. I hate purple. If I never have to see him or touch him again, it I would be Isn't that weird that there's just some colors that are so much tougher to get in? I had a purple tattoo today, man. I hated every second of it, you know? It's like, why why purple?

There's like no mid and purple. It's like dark and light. And you always have a mess with one color, too. You ever noticed that? Like every time I'd have a mess, it'd be orange. Like I'd be like, how did I get I didn't even use orange today. Why is it on my pants? I don't know why I just see lavender smears.

I'm like, "Get the [ __ ] lavender off. I can't stand the lavender. You can can never get it off. You just keep rubbing it. It's only got a tattoo with a wet paper towel. You're like, "Dude, this is gross. " Like, great, great day. Awesome.

Love it. Oh god. Yeah. I remember Phil's I I don't know if we already talked about it, but that his butthole tattoo that girl brought in all the pictures of the butthole. Oh yeah. So weird, dude. The more the more I let her know that I wasn't into it, the more she just like I feel like that was her stick right there. Right.

Was Yeah. That was her stick was to make me feel uncomfortable. And boy, did she make and finally I was just like, I am not tattooing around your ass. Like it's just not happening. We didn't get a lot of those at at at your at your shop, but I felt like a little far off the strip. It wasn't like when I tattooed on the strip and it was just like maniac after maniac that just wanted the weirdest like tattooing was still booming like crazy. You know, we opened up that shop in 2006 and we were 2 miles off the boulevard. This is before Uber and all that stuff.

So the cab drivers were still kind of worried. There's also a tenth of the tattoo shops that they're Do you remember Do you remember the cab driver uh hustle where where they'd like get money? Yes. From the tattoo shop. I don't I don't know. They would Yeah. The strip clubs would give them 20 bucks. Yeah.

Are you Uber friendly? 100 I think cab driver. Are you cab driver friendly? That was it. And I used to have to come out and beef with them because I was like, "No, the [ __ ] got in your car. They have appointments. " But there are dispensaries in town that do give kickback to the Uber drivers. Yeah.

I not that I do that stuff. I'm just saying I passed by a couple of times. Yeah. I think strip clubs like Well, you had to take a taxi, right? " Because they'd only take them to the ones that would give them like 20, 40 bucks ahead. I know Diversity used to do it. And I think that started with the stripper industry, right? Yes.

Yeah. So, they 20 bucks. I think they do like 80 bucks ahead these days or something like that. I mean, that's a pretty good You take five guys to a strip club, that's like your night, dude. 80 bucks ahead, dude. Jeez. All you did was give somebody a ride. All right.

All right. There's lots of scams in Vegas back then, though, right? Hustles. Like, yeah, it's definitely like a I remember my mom telling me like, "If you can grow up here, we moved here when I was in fourth grade. She's like, you could grow up anywhere. " And meanwhile, we're like, you know, then like a couple years later, we're like in a high school kids [ __ ] private party and there's like three stories and a nund kids in there and like live sex shows and you're like, "What is like I was like, "Oh, Las Vegas is or and you're the area in the middle of a desert with a bunch of wild looking dudes with mohawks and like just kegs of beer and you're just partying in the middle of the desert and you're like 15. " You know, put your whale out in the desert.

Who's going to come? But now you were born in California. I was born in Southern California, but we came here uh I mean I think I was seven when we came here. So I was like 87 or Oh, I thought you were a little bit older than that. I didn't realize you were that young. And so I'm thankful for like Yeah, definitely. U I'm I'm thankful for my upbringing here cuz I just feel like it was so wild and and different. I mean, I was riding my BMX up and down Las Vegas Boulevard when I was 15 years old.

I mean weird. Yeah. Finding the halfopen beers, man, that were left around everywhere. It be like cool in the desert and [ __ ] Oh, dude. Yeah. I mean, all the things you find in the desert here was crazy, man. There's so many things. But just knowing like when I go down the strip these days, it's like I know every road here.

I know every back road here. I know how to get in and out. And um I was thankful. I had a lot of fun riding my BMX around uh the strip when you're 15, you know, and now when you see things like all the sporting events and everything, you're just like, man, this is so crazy how different it was, you know, back then. Dude, I mean, as far as tattooing, too. I mean, what do we have like a a tattoo shop in almost every casino? That's a crazy thing. Our our ecosystem, our environment for tattooing is very different from every other city.

Yeah. Yo, hell yeah. Very different. Hell yeah. Well, I remember before I came to work for you guys, I had called the board of health. I wanted to know exactly what was going on. And there were 47 tattoo shops in Las Vegas before I moved out there that 2008. Just before we closed Old Vegas, talking to the board of health, she told me 729 legal shops, not the private studios.

That's a lot. That's a huge increase in 12 years. I mean, right on my block, dude. You remember Studio 21 was like right around we were right on Decar and or I mean Jones and Flamingo, but I think at a peak there was pro I think close to like nine shops like within like in the vicinity. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like like within like you know two blocks each direction.

two opened up in my vicinity within the five years, you know? Oh, really? Yeah. [ __ ] Yeah. Like I opened mine and then the one dude that used to work at downtown opened up on Charleston and and Rainbow. Oh, okay. I was like, "All right, man. Cool.

Right on. " Yeah. It's just That's how it is, though. You can't You can't control that. You got to just figure out how to stand up, stand out, be nice to people, do a good job, and people will come back. They'll be loyal to your shop and your tattoos, you know? Show up. Show up, man.

Just be there. Show it with a smile. Be there. Be sober. You know, like don't I don't know, man. Every shop you walk into, it's like like a lot of things are the same on the wall or nothing on the walls. That drives me that mindboggling to me, bro. Mindboggling to me.

There's just no I mean I know you're like much into character and and and the the theme of places and things and it's like it's so weird when it like looks like the Apple store. Like what am I doing here? Like am I getting a tattoo or? Yeah. Like I get it. Like I as far as the I don't know the aesthetics of like I don't know retail or something like that. There's different I get it. I just I definitely like I always like when we built out our sec second shop I I remember being like I just want everyone to walk in here and be so overwhelmed with [ __ ] you know, to look at and stories to talk about and things to see that I I don't know.

That was just like kind of my motivation. I wanted them to be able to leave and have so much more to talk about. Yeah. like you went and taught cool stuff and a lot of people did like I felt like when people came in and brought their friends they'd be like oh look at all this they told me this about this and you still have the map up there and stuff like that that's awesome man I've been there I'll be there I'll come to the record show well nowadays there's so many shops it's like dude oh you don't even know who's on your block well I want yeah and I miss like I want more I went six months not even knowing that there was another tattoo shop in my parking lot it took six months for me to find out that there was another tattoo shop in my park it was a private studio of course but But I kicked myself and how you know like for that to not be on my radar was like I felt stupid you know private studio thing is so strange to me like I would want a tattoo anywhere where like I wasn't around other tattoo artists or like we're people people though we're people people that's right there are some people that are not people is the most important thing like how big is your clientele that you can survive on just that clientele I think we'll see right now I mean we're seeing a lot of like it's this in this interesting cleansing period My one of my guys in my shop is telling me there's a new Tik Tok trend right now where it's like they're telling coming out as they're quitting tattooing and then like a lot of people are like applauding them and like I was like what are you even talking about?

I saw two today. I saw two today on Instagram. Really? There'll be all these comments. He told me there's like all these comments that are like oh good for you like I couldn't do it either. I quit you know and I was like that's really interesting man cuz that was like never an option for me. Well at least they're being kind about it and not just [ __ ] in the comments. I guess so.

Yeah. Yeah, like that. When I started tattooing, I don't feel like that was ever an option. I don't like I still don't. No, it's I mean I got nothing else, dude. Maybe one of my kids will do something awesome, you know? I don't know. They got no interest in tattooing.

" Like, and it's just like that old meme you see, the Slayer meme, you know? It's like, you know, uh you're not even cool to a teenage girl if you're the lead singer of Slayer, you You know, it's like the guy the guy from Slayer is like doing this and his teenage daughter is just like rolling her eyes. It's like you're not even cool if your dad's a tattoo artist or owns a tattoo shop. He's still not cool. You know, teenage kids, man. You got it incoming, dude. It's coming for you. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. You're going to trip. It gets real weird. It gets really strange. Like, it's so weird that I have these little humans that I made and they're just like, they like rag me, dude. They like they like rag me out, dude. That's kind of They clown on me.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, like I wouldn't want I wouldn't want them not to talk [ __ ] and have fun. Watching us right here. " You know, like, "Wow, really? " But damn, man. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I Dude, I I don't know. I'm like I love that our energy though, like I feel overall though that even though we've been in it for a minute, like we we still we just like have good things to say about it. Like even though we might not agree with like some of the younger kind of things, but like I'm still fascinated by it like every day and I want to figure out how to apply like newer ideas and energy that people are, you know, bringing to the table. Yeah. Nothing's worse than talking to somebody that's like super hard-headed about it has to be this way, it has to be this way. And it's like, dude, just let it do what it's going to do, man.

You know? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, [ __ ] we're sitting here doing these things. Like, this isn't something that I wouldn't done back in the day, you know? But now it's like, "Oh, okay. " That's what everybody tells me, you know? " I'm like, "Yeah, I don't [ __ ] want to, man.

I don't want to either. " It's like, can Why don't you do You're so good, though. You're personal. I know, man. I really should. I'll tell you the mics to get and whatever. It's just it's just what you I feel like me and Nick should do it just for fun. Bones has been good at He's been throwing himself out there.

Mr. Bones. Yes, he is. Yes, he is. Nobody I'll fight somebody over that, man. He's the best dude. Like, he's a sweetheart. He's good dude.

I'm I'm excited for him and his journey now. And he, you know, he's going to get in that van and do his thing. Was he hitting the road again? They're going to be They're going to hit it like move out of their apartment like permanently. Really? He's going to come back to the hive like once a month or you know once every five weeks. Do the whole country everywhere. Anywhere and everywhere.

I meant to Yeah, I need to hit him up because I I had an idea that I thought that he could help like um like al also like subsidize some income and like sell Maverick on the road at like trade shows or something, you know? So that way we and I could ship stuff to him, you know. He's like some he's the person that I would trust, you know, and like he's so sweet. He's a great communicator. He helps me with anything I ask him to do. Anything I ask him, I want to do something dumb. You want to dig a pool, Nick? He's in.

Yeah. You know, do you you want me to I want to frame this whole thing out. He's in. Like, doesn't complain. We just get it done, you know? We've done work on his van. He's so different from all of us, too, you know? And that's what I We're completely different guys.

Me and Nick Bones are completely different guys, but somehow we have the greatest friendship. Like, it's it it trips me out still. He's completely opposite for me. Like, but he's so fun and he's cool to talk to and he's always pumped, you know? He was excited to do things and it's cool, man. And all the gym that we did, let nothing get him down. No, man. It's cuz, you know, it was rough for him when he was young.

So, when things are rough when you're younger, man. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, you talk about being broke again. We'll both say it. Been broke before. I mean, you know, it's the worst that can happen. You know, it's like, dude, when I first started tattooing, I was I was scared, dude.

I, you know, I quit my I I had a full-time job and I was doing my apprentichip and then I quit t uh I was working at a um I was a server at a a golf course, right? You know, and then I Yeah. And then uh but I remember quitting and and going like, "All right, dude. I'm going to do this like full-time. My rent was $400 a month. My truck was paid for. I paid $3,000 for it. And I remember going to work and making like 500 bucks.

And I went home and I I I remember my sister's boyfriend at the time. He got a safe. He worked for a safe company. " Like anything on top of this is icing on the cake. Like I could live like this for the rest of my [ __ ] life. I'm getting to go to work. I'm getting to draw. I'm getting to meet characters.

And then I get two [ __ ] beers and I smoke a little weed on the tailgate of my badass apartment that has a garage is 400 bucks a month. Like I was like I and I still to this day always remember that like I don't give a [ __ ] about anything that I acquire. Like I care and I'm great. I'm very grateful for it. But like if I go back to two Heineken 22s at the end of the night on a tailgate with the desert [ __ ] night, you know, it's like this is a good life, dude. You know, it's great. It's great. I I remember when I had my first like real money day.

Like I don't know. I worked in a sketchy like 250 bucks or something I made or something. I was like, "Wow, dude. " I can't I mean before that I was pulling [ __ ] human [ __ ] out of a toilet for $30 in tips. I was just telling him on the way over here I was like I [ __ ] worked at a bar and it was a bus boy and made 30 bucks and tips a night and and they had Joerger specials and these construction workers would come in and drink like a hundred [ __ ] shots of Joers for three bucks a piece or whatever. Dude [ __ ] his pants and who had to go in there and [ __ ] pull it out with a mop stick and put it in there. So going to work and tattooing and dealing with some weird ass people was [ __ ] golden, dude. You know, I just cleaned the [ __ ] bathroom in the shop the other day.

It happens, though. Sometimes it's a wreck, dude. You got to do it. It's your place, man. You want You want it to be nice. That's why I tell everybody to the shop. I was like, I just want this place to be nice, man. I want the bathrooms to be clean.

I want people to be comfortable. That's it. Yeah. Comfortable, clean, nice tattoo, good experience. That's it. Especially when you got ladies in the shop. I'm like come in here and I remember [ __ ] fat tattooers with hairy butts like sitting on my [ __ ] And I remember having to like [ __ ] clean that and be like wreaking like [ __ ] co cigarettes out all night. Dude, those guys there are some rough rough dudes, man.

I wish I could just remember all of them to tell you the truth. But but now when you got into it here, both of you when you guys got into it in Vegas, it was a very biker. It was like the tail end of the bikers. Okay. It was like bongs and bikers. Bongs and bikers. So there was bong shops that did tattooing and then yeah, it was the tail end. There was there was some like um you know bike culture group shops, you know, and I worked at one of them.

And then um but there were still biker tattooers that you know rode rode Harley's and look like what they were supposed to look like. Man, I think they're And were they affiliated or Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure. Yeah, I was very open. I had them standing over me with their jackets on and everything telling me what to do.

And I was like, uh, I was used to being around him because my dad owned Harley's and we did a lot of like bike stuff like growing up. So, I knew he's just there's simple rules like shut the [ __ ] up. Don't be disrespectful, you know? It's like and nobody's going to really bother you and stick up for yourself or just dip. Just get the [ __ ] out. Irish goodbye every time. Dude, I got to go. I'm going to the bathroom.

Yeah. But yeah, there was there was opposing clubs had shots. I think it was like the tail end of like Yeah. things were changing. A lot of younger guys were coming in that were artists and but there were still like some sketchy biker dudes around town for sure. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I worked at Fremont.

That that was a whole period I kind of even forgot to talk about was when I got off my piercing apprenticeship, they stuck me down on Fremont before they redid all that Fremont. And that was like one of the sketchiest places in town. And this was this was one of Sheila's shops as well. Yes, it was the uncle shop. Uncle I do remember that. And it was a big metal hanger. It looked like a airplane hanger with metal walls. Metal walls and metal ceilings all like a Quanza hut.

Like those dome type things. But two I think it's where um why do I not remember that? Where uh the Griffin is now. I'm I'm almost positive. So that's like before any of that got redid. It was like still real old shitty Fremont. It was like weird watch repair place across the street and like just hookers and drug dealers all in that whole section. You know, the one shop or the the joint was down there, the graffiti shop.

Graffiti shop was up the road a little bit. Um and then we were actually on Fremont and then there was like a pizza place there and a hot dog place. Weird sketchy hot dog place. And the sheriff card building that is now Triple Beast. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

We used to have to go get our um Where did you see more crazy [ __ ] on the strip or on Fremont. I saw I saw more on the strip. I think I mean all the time there would be wild things happening. I mean Latin City was right behind there. There was a day there was a night where a dude walked up to the [ __ ] uh gasoline pump. I saw the video of this ran his ATM car and just started drinking gasoline and like pouring it all over himself and he lit himself up right there right next to the shop and just like woo like a mushroom cloud. The dude's just like on fire. " Yeah.

" I was like, "I don't know, man. " You know? Yeah. " And I didn't know. I didn't even know what I was walking into. And I remember watching that video and just that [ __ ] me up for a couple of weeks, that video. Yeah, it was it was a real deal. It was a real deal.

Uh car accidents like crazy down there. I mean I think the I think the guy we talked about earlier, Ninja kicked a dude into traffic uh one time. Kicked him out of the door. The dude almost got hit by a bus. There's like a tall piercer that got hit by the mirror of the bus one time. It's right in his head. There's massive car accidents all the time. People just getting in crazy fights out there.

Definitely a couple gunfights here and there. Well, back to Bum Fights. That was the corner that they smashed all the windows out on, right? Yeah. And it wasn't the tattoo shop. It was the like the Bonanza gift shop or whatever it was. Yeah. They smashed all those windows out.

But that that's that corner. Yeah. I remember sitting in traffic and this dude with a bat just [ __ ] started taking out all the windows of the car in front of me. Right in front of that shop. And I was like, and you can't you're bumper to bumper. You can't go anywhere. And you're just like, "Please don't come back here. Don't let me be next.

" Knock on people's windows all the way down. They stay coming in the shop. Guys that just smell like everything under the sun. I mean, they've been sleeping out in this desert heat and they'd walk into the tattoo shop and like these counter kids would sometimes like let them use the bathroom. So, they'd be in there for like 2 hours. They come out and just destroy those bathrooms. It would smell like whatever they were smoking in there. Cuz they had like a tray of crack pipes that they would sell there with numbers on it.

Oh yeah. Yeah. " You know, they sell number four crack pipes all day. Oh, that was wild. That was They literally had crack pipes for sale in their store. So, it brought in obviously not the most elegant. I think they had them like on a tray and they put the tray away, right? You know, it's like it was all paraphernia and then these trays and then like what what's they sell in all the bong shops back then is like incense bongs like those those things you drink to make you not pass drug test which don't [ __ ] work.

I tried I couldn't get that job at Albert. Turned out it worked out for me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All for smoking weed. And I had to fail it right in front of my dad who was probably [ __ ] high when I was there.

And then he was giving me [ __ ] Thousand% dude. Huh. Thousand%. Yeah. This is dude. Yeah. Las Vegas tattoos. I mean I all I'm sure obviously all over.

But um it that's what we got to experience and it was it was a good time. I did like it though when I was younger. I thought it was [ __ ] awesome. Now I'm like get the [ __ ] away from my shop. Like get on. Yeah, we have like a bad fentanyl and [ __ ] heroin problem in your parking lot now. Yeah, always. Oh, get out.

Really? Yeah, it's bad. Like Well, yeah. Yeah, but I you know, it's like a fancier place for the fentanyl [ __ ] heads. I don't even know what you call them. Like they're just like they're wild, bro. Like just this week this is their lady with a boot on. She's in a walker and she's just like shut up in the middle of the road and I'm always like, "Hey, excuse me.

Do you mind leaving? " And I try to like kill him with kindness. the other day, schizophrenic dude just straight built a whole entire like house in front of my shop. Yeah. And I was like I was like, "Hey man, uh good job on the on the property here. " He took that bottle of water and threw it and jumped up and started screaming at me. " Like that was another thing we used to have to deal with. Like everybody would have to try to get those guys off the sidewalk in the morning.

Yeah. Like if I had the morning shift, there was two shifts, right? 10 to 4. Sleep in the doorway. Yeah. 10 to 5 or 9 to5, like 9 to 4 and then like 4 to 2 in the morning or something like that. I I can't really remember to tell you the truth, but if you're the morning guy, you had to clear them out. So if there was a guy sleeping against the door, if there was a guy sleeping up, you like wake them up.

And every time they'd either get up and move or they'd get up and try to fight you or they'd get up and try to tackle you. And you don't want these guys touching you. Oh, dude. Yeah. It's the worst way to start your day at work. You're like, "Fuck, man. I just want to work, dude. " And I'm like, "Not a super germaphobe, but I definitely don't want that dirty griiness.

I don't want any of that on me now, bro. I can't even breathe. " Like, that's why I try to like help them, but then they, you know, they don't want to have anything to do with you. Yeah. I mean, back then it turned into like I think we got a hose finally and then we got like a bucket finally and it was just like dude I rolled up one day and there was six lawn chairs in a circle in this and they were all nodding off and they all had the needles in their arms and they were like, you know, I I'm thinking of a story of that shop on the strip. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we have a When you guys were on the strip, did you work with Opie at all? I did work with Opie. Were you there when he got beat up by the homeless guy? I was there. And actually, I think he had given me a hard time the day before or something. So, I just let I just I just let it happen.

Guy gave me a hard time, man. I was like, "Fuck that, man. " But he was talking, if I recall right, he was like talking a lot of [ __ ] to him. And I was like, "Bro, these people have nothing, too. They got nothing to lose, right? They got nothing to lose. We got things to lose. " So, you know, you got to respect them at that point.

But, but we [ __ ] with them constantly, dude. I mean, we glue quarters to the ground, you know, like do that dollar bills, you know, you glue them to the ground. You just sit there and watch them try to get it up all day. And the one guy got smart, he'd come by with the the screwdriver and the hammer and he get them all. There's always someone who gets in in Yeah. Always. Some of them are pretty. Yeah.

Yeah. And we'd be sitting there and it would happen. We'd go, "All right, man. You deserve it. He did it. He did it. You got it up. " just stay messing with them all the time, especially in the mornings cuz they've been awake for five, six, seven days, whatever, dude.

You know, like I don't know. No joke. But you're right. I'm older now. I wonder how I deal with that. I'm I'm lucky wherever we put Hive because I don't get that a lot. I get like once in a while the one that goes behind the Yeah, you're in a good spot. We're still Dude, we're still close to the strip.

So, we just get all of that energy right off the strip as I had to ask a dude to leave the other day. He just rolled in a wheelchair. He definitely could walk and everything. He just decided, I just want to live in this wheelchair and I never want to bathe and I never want to get out of it to use the restroom and he just rolled right into the shop. " You know, and he just had the longest story. " And he I just like, "Oh, that's cool, man. " I don't know why I just always offer bottle water like hey you know and I'm like start opening the door I was like a it's just so nice out here like maybe come on out here yeah get some fresh air bro yeah we got that's crazy you're dealing with it like that yeah we have a female dwarf that rides a child's bike and does fentanyl all day long while and she nods off on the Oh she's good for you're like oh Phil Phil knows her knows her Phil's a nuts Bill was pretty good at talking to all the homeless people.

The homeless loved me. Yeah, they love you. Like know their name. I was their mayor. Yeah. Phil's out there with Jeff or whatever, you know? Like they all knew you for some reason. The generates love me.

Talking on the I think that comes from you coming from New York, though. Yeah. Oh, totally. They can smell it on you away. They're like, "This guy, this guy, he knows idiots. This guy clearly knows idiots. Or at least tell me a story. Yeah, I gave out a lot of cigarettes in that parking lot.

No doubt. I gave out a lot of cigarettes in that parking. I remember it being like decent though. I mean, we we had a few. Dude, remember that time the girls with the taxi, you had to lock them out. The crazy the crazy girls. The zombie girls. Was I there or was that just you and Courtney that were there?

I I feel like we were all there like No, I was there. I was there. Yeah. Yeah. Well, now you got to tell the story. Yeah. Okay. Okay.

So, there was a there was a real popular restaurant like right in our spot and then right in front of our shop is an Arby's. And there was this big black SUV in the drive-thru at Arby's. And apparently, I'm assuming they were persuasive men that had young ladies that had some sort of business arrangement with them or something. Yeah. Uh all of a sudden, the the doors open. There's screaming going on and we and we're just kind of like out front. I think the door was open because it was a beautiful I remember it being like a beautiful night. I don't know why, but yeah.

Yeah, the door open. That's right. Yeah, because I remember all of a sudden hearing all this commotion screaming out front. " And all those people were in front of the restaurant and they were all panicking and we were all kind of in and out of front and then I realized like oh like I I feel like I started to go over there and say something and then I realized it was like a definitely not a good situation and the girls were like overdosing on something. Yeah. But they were like faces were like all red blonde girls and stuff too. Yeah. And I remember like foam like foam or like snot or something, you know?

It was It reminded me of some Pulp Fiction [ __ ] But then the dudes just jumped in the truck and then jumped the curb and bounced. And then these girls were just screaming and bloody murder. But it wasn't like they were like no one was hurting them. They were just freaking out. It was really weird. Yeah. And then you just pulled the door closed. I just had to pull the door closed cuz they were trying to get in the shop and it was like a real [ __ ] up situation and all these people I don't know.

We didn't I I think we just stay in the shop. " Yeah. So I tell him at the Especially we got girls up front and stuff. I'm like just close the door and like be safe, dude. Like Courtney came over and like shut the curtains. Like we're just like nah let them deal with that. It was one one of the more emotional I mean we called the police and like we're getting an ambulance came in like 15 minutes or some [ __ ] I remember that. But I and they were like helping him out but they weren't like in they didn't want help but they were just I don't know what they were out of their minds.

Whatever was going on. I never seen like a human act like that before. was definitely like on some really crazy drug [ __ ] But like I remember that night for some reason. I don't know. I think it was just us three there or something. Okay. Well, I changed my mind. Maybe the parking lot was just as wild.

There was one point when they found a dead body in in a car in front of the Chinese place. Remember that? I don't remember that. But we had a shootout in the parking lot and the dude died right in and behind like right in front of a shop. That's right. And then there was like was it dude chas the other dude with a screwdriver or something? Remember that guy? That crazy guy.

It was you coming up Flamingo. He was drugged out of his mind. He was on pills and he [ __ ] just straight up tried to turn into our parking lot with two flat tires. Yes. And then once the wheels hit the curb, they popped his car up and he ran up into the landscaping and hit the palm tree. And we were having some problems with some kids or somebody was like [ __ ] with our windows. So I heard all this noise. So I just like pulled off my gloves, ran outside.

Dude was like nodding off and then like you know he was just [ __ ] up. So he backs back out into the road and then drive like I'm like right up by his window and then he just starts trying to back up and then go and he pulls up into the parking lot and it has four flats at this point in time. " Like, you know what? What is happening? You need to chill out. Like and he he just was like yelling at me and screaming and and then he just walks right past me like I didn't even exist. That's right. And then he went into the bar and I don't know what happened.

Like his car was like doors were open and running when he went into the shop. Oh. " And I was like, I followed him in there and I don't know why I just kind of lost my cool. I mean, I guess because of all this, I lost my cool. I just ran up on him and I just pushed him super hard and I grabbed his keys and I [ __ ] just turned around and he like fell and then the bartender's freaking out like I was like a crazy person. His mom was a [ __ ] bartender. Yeah. So, she's tripping on me because I just rolled in and [ __ ] pushed him down.

And then I So, I come back out of the um of the bar and I'm walking back and I just hear someone screaming and kind of like running behind me. " Like, but he wasn't like running good. He was [ __ ] up. So, I just took the keys and I just threw him like in all of my like lack of sports glory thought that I was going to be able to nail him in the face with the keys and they just went like seven feet over there and and I was all damn it, dude. I was that was my time to shine. I was going to put this dude down and now he's got a knife and I'm like I'm like I don't [ __ ] know knife fighting yet, you know? So I just turned around and I was like just walked kept walking away from him. He was like that [ __ ] up.

He was like stumbling and [ __ ] and then just walked in the shop and locked the door, dude. And the cops the cops [ __ ] rolled up and like I was like dude has a knife. He's [ __ ] crazy tripping and they're pulling all these crazy amounts of drugs out of his car, dude. Yeah. And then the knife the guy pulls out the knife and it's like a 4 inch blade or something. " The cop. " Like what the [ __ ] It's a [ __ ] knife. Like, how far is my [ __ ] liver from my skin?

I don't know. I'm pretty sure it's less than 4 in. " And I just walked back in the shop. But it was a total mixed bag in that parking lot cuz it wasn't uncommon to see a McLaren pulling up for the restaurant, you know? Then there was the the bowling place for a while. Yeah. We had the links two pimps in a [ __ ] Maserati. What was that dude's name?

You remember that dude's name? Yeah. He used to come in. We used to He wanted us to draw money bags and he would make them into big ass gold chains. Yeah. I can't remember his name. I can't remember his name either. He was cool.

Pink diamonds. Pink diamonds. And he always had like a Maserati or Lamborghini. He straight had a [ __ ] Minkx in it or some sort of like rare tiger. Like it was like a large ass cat. Like only in Vegas. That [ __ ] only happens in Vegas. He was like eight foot tall black dude, man.

Like with these pink diamonds. Nicest dude ever. But I was like, bro, he was definitely somebody where you're like, I don't know what is is going to pop off right now, you know? I remember how he was tied in with another dude I knew and that they had like a lion in their house at one point. Like a like a lion cub. Like they were into like trading like uh you know, savage cats and earlucking cat was like this big, dude. I'm like it's not a a bobcat or something crazy. Yeah.

I just remember looking in the car. " I do remember that. We had a car coming up the [ __ ] street one day just start flipping, dude. Flipping and flipping. I remember that. In front of the shop and then poor girl lost her hand. Remember that? Fingers or whatever.

Jumped out of the car, had half a hand, and the three dudes that were in the car bounced, just ran on her ass, dude. Left her in there. The car caught on [ __ ] fire, dude. My brother-in-law pulled her out like right in front. He put He put the fire out, too. Yeah. Yeah. Rest of us standing there like, I don't know what to do, man.

This is crazy. Yeah. I pulled I pulled a lady out of a [ __ ] Ford Ranger that wrecked into the shop like landscaping and she straight had a cocktail in her hand and was screaming at the other guy because she was up in the hard right lane [ __ ] doing like 60 past everybody in the parking and and then the dude just pulls over. She hits him, bounces into the shop. She gets out with her cocktail. [ __ ] you. Like I was like I couldn't get the door open. The [ __ ] truck was on fire and her cab was filling with smoke.

So, I had to run around and open up the other door and then she's all bleeding from the uh [ __ ] airbag and everything and I pull her out. There's the other dude that couldn't speak any English. Yeah. There's the other dude that couldn't speak English that like ran into the other car and he's sitting there saying, "I'm not drunk. " But he can't even stand up. He's like falling off the curb and we're all like, "I don't know, man. " I remember I just I I remember having to almost fight one of my clients because he he was an attorney. Got off work, came in, I was working on his full back piece.

He was kept going to the bathroom and I was like, "Okay, man. " And then it was like all of a sudden he was shitous, like hammered. He had a bottle of vodka he had stuffed behind the toilet in the bathroom and was taking pills. And he he was so [ __ ] drunk I couldn't even keep him on the table. He was like started to flop off. I was like, "Bud, we got to like call it a night. " He just started getting all and he he's my boy like but he was not in it like at this point in time. So whatever.

So he ends up like going out to the lobby. The lobby's full of tattoo like all of our other customers. He goes face down on the [ __ ] couch and farts so loud, dude. So [ __ ] loud. and all the other clients get up and like move over to the other side of the lobby and then me and my dad are trying to get him up and like and then all of a sudden he just [ __ ] darts like to his truck and he gets in his truck and he can't [ __ ] he's got he's got it started but he can't get his foot like onto the gas pedal and everything. We ended up having to take the keys out through him call his wife [ __ ] he got to come pick him up so much crazy Uber is like the greatest thing that's ever happened in this city. Yeah, man. Yeah, I stay I stay taking Ubers if I if I drink anymore, man.

Just got too much. Like we talked about earlier, some of these people got nothing to lose, man. But I not me, man. I love taking an Uber. Yeah, most of the time. Most of Oh, [ __ ] And we we went off on some tangents tonight. I got a question. What was your first setup?

What were your first machines? My first machines were national machines. Nationals? What? Which nationals machines? I think they were the swing gates. Like the They were just chrome. Yeah.

Yeah. The Yeah, that's one I ground the crows off. I tried to make Yeah. Yeah. I tried to make it look vintage later on. Get it off. But Oh, yeah. Shitty little Yeah, that's it, dude.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Had like the blue coils, the old school like reflective, right? Yeah. With that little circle. And what was your power unit? Was your power unit?

The big big black brick. Oh, wow. With the two the two displays. The two displays on it. Yeah. I bought it from some other kid that was trying to learn how to tattoo and he gave up. And so I bought it off of him from one of the other guys, one of the other guys apprentice and he sold me everything I think cheap. I wish I had that stuff still.

There's a lot of things I got rid of that I wish I would have had that. Really? Yeah. So I had the two nationals for a long time and then my first real set I bought with my own money were were Danny Fowler time machines. Oh god. Yeah. I got those cuz they had sets, right? So I bought the invader set and then I used those forever and then it was just about buying random machines that people came through with whatever.

Just tried it. I just all I always just tried everything cuz I felt like everybody had learned how to tattoo knew a lot but they didn't know a lot down that alley. Not a lot of people knew a lot about machines, right? Right. There were very few um bespoke uh uh builders out there at that. These days they're a dime a dozen. These days it's a dime a dozen. But yeah, you definitely relied on on the bigger suppliers.

Big Joe's, Nationals, Bald Inc. Cam got huge. Big when I was really young. Cam's back. Oh, really? Are they? Wow. It's crazy.

Fatty lives in Hemet, right? So, it's always trip I always tripped out that like all those boxes would come from Hemet all the time, you know. Oh, I didn't I never even knew that's where where they were. I I always thought Cam was Northern California. It was Hemet California in the desert. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So, I used to use those really terrible um disposable uh tubes like where like everything would get so hot that the Yeah. Yeah. Like the like your your your grip would just go, but I was so like I didn't want to scrub tubes anymore. I'd scrub tubes for too long and I was like totally against it. And then I, you know, I use those forever. And then I use the Neotats for a long time. And then I just use Pen Machine now. Yeah.

Yeah. I just use this guy's cartridges, too. Since you got to go all the way to China and see them. Yeah. [ __ ] a, dude. I just got back. Yeah. It's wild, dude.

It was really I got to see our product get made from start to Oh, really? No [ __ ] Everybody that has their hands on it. I got to like your first time. Yeah, that was my first time. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm gonna try to go. you the only supplier that he's supplying with tattoo stuff or what?

Uh no, he's he has international clients, you know, like all over the world, but like now we're build we've we're building like all of our own specific stuff. It's It's pretty cool. That is cool. I get I get like so hyped for everybody that does cool [ __ ] all the time. " Like, dude, it's I'm still kind of in shock. I'm like, "Dang, this is like a It was so wild to like all the time and energy that we put into this company and then to be able to go right to where it [ __ ] starts and like and he's making everything in-house. He's doing the whole everything. It's pretty wild, dude.

Yeah, it's pretty wild. It's like really cool. I got to like literally like as soon as the cartridge shell pops out of the the the you know the molds like and then you go over and then we put the needles in and line up the membrane and then uh attach it to the piston you know and then snap them together and then put them in the little blister packs and then put our paper on them and then compress them. I've always wondered what the sterilization process is on that stuff. It's all eel gas sterilized. So, it's a giant [ __ ] bin. You you they roll everything in there and it's compressed gas. How big of a of a Is it a room or is it an actual Pretty Yeah, it's pretty [ __ ] big.

Yeah. Yeah. It's like a I've always wondered how they do that sterilization on that stuff. Yeah. Hopefully you got some pictures you could show me sometime. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I got like I was worried I wasn't, you know, allowed to take pictures in a manufacturing facility. I don't I don't know. I didn't really know, but it was cool. Totally. " But I was still shy. I'm like [ __ ] I don't know. I like it was cool. Oh, this is kind of fun, too.

So, yeah. So, we're like working on all of our product and uh he was like showing me the the samples that we had put together and stuff and um so he he's I was like I'm sorry I didn't bring any pen like a machine or anything and he he just pulls out this random like [ __ ] machine that he has and then and some fake skin and then we just start plugging in the cartridges and I was like just heads up like I I'm at a [ __ ] ball like a boardroom table like in front of people and you know and uh put out the ink and everything. I was like, I never tattooed like fake skin before, you know. And then I go to I was I felt weird not having gloves on and [ __ ] you know, and I go to dip in and I start run my first line and I was like, "Oh, [ __ ] Yeah, these these feel good.

" And then I go back to dip again and I hit the edge of the cup and [ __ ] blast black ink all over the place. Of course. And I was all ah, you're like, "Pro move. " Man, it was funny. I felt like I was like I was just laughing at myself like I'm so [ __ ] goofy, dude. Like his dad Yeah, his dad and then his um his dad and his buddy bought these two big parcels like a like a good um I I want to say like probably in the ' 90s. I didn't really get like exact dates because the I was just kind of judging by the way the buildings looked and uh the way they were built and then they split and then they built these big um warehouses, big longass warehouses. So then our factory is on one side and then the uncle's factory, he called them uncle um uh is on the other and they they didn't do anything to do with tattooing there, but we we build all of our cartridges and everything there and then the mold shops right behind there.

So, like as soon as we design something, we can go to the mold shop, get the molds built, and then just pull them right there. So, I got to tour that and everything. And like, yeah, it's pretty cool, dude. Uh, dude, the Yeah. Everything that we like here, and I'm like, it's not like that over there. It's [ __ ] awesome. It's very clean, incredibly safe. Uh, like especially in our factory, like it's [ __ ] legit.

" You know, I was honestly like as an American guy, like what we've told about factories, like I was like worried. Right. Right. So organized. Yes. I was like scared, dude. You know, I'm not going to lie. I was like, ah, if I'm going to see something that I don't [ __ ] like and then I'm going to be like, what the [ __ ] am I going to do now?

You know, and um so it was great. He just does tattoo stuff or does he do other stuff as well? Just only our cartridges. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I got to see like all these new machines that we invested in and uh that are all specifically because of like our volume and everything.

We've been able to like level up and like it's pretty dope, dude. So, now we're like we're just working on every little detail of of like all of the I I nerd out on that [ __ ] you know? So like not not only on the cartridges or whatever, but I want like the packaging to be like this and I want it to be like this and I want it to feel like this and I want it to the experience to be something for, you know, a tattooer to open and feel like proud and and fulfilled by, you know. So talking about, man, it's cool. Be cool. Be proud of it, you know. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Make cool [ __ ] you know, and people will gravitate towards it for sure. I think so. It's like, you know, and and when We were just talking about the donut thing before. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I still have that doughnut shop in my backyard, by the way.

Yeah. It It's going to pop off. I'm going to put my kids to work on that [ __ ] I want them to like learn. [ __ ] yeah, dude. I just want to teach them how to make cash and how to talk to people and how to build like a brand and an experience for people and uh get them to the point to where they can, you know, make some extra cash and then get them to save up and invest in their own [ __ ] you know? So I said oldest one likes she likes money, man. She's trying to work now. She's she's such a G.

She'd be like paying her younger sister to make her a sandwich or make her, you know what I mean? It just happened yesterday. Like she got paid to make a bagel. The other one's like the other one's like she's a dumb. Mine are battling at the counter and breakfast right now too over that. Like oh well I'll pay you to do this and I will do this you know and you're like okay girl you're four and you're out here trying I'll pay you $100 Grayson. " You know, first of all, you don't got a 100 bucks, but your brother does. I seen him stacking, dude.

He's like over there stacking, dude. He [ __ ] puts it puts it away. You and Courtney's personalities were so different. Yeah. Yeah. My sister's real different than me. Your kids? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm my son and my wife is my daughter. Yeah. It's crazy. And she even looks like one looks Filipino and one looks white. Dude, we need a whole other two hours to talk about Courtney, I think. No joke.

That's a great interview, bro. She has to come in. If you get us all here, she has to be there. Oh my god. The laughs that would be had at that would just be absolutely insane, man. It was a lot of good times back then, man. So many. So many we can't even remember.

We just brought up a few. I mean, there's probably hundreds of them. Every day there was crazy [ __ ] going on. Every day. We went out a lot. Yeah. And my family, like my, you know, I partnered up with my mom and my dad in 2003 and then my sister came on board like 2006 or seven and then she Yeah. 08.

Summer of 08. And then she had some kids like a year later, but she was there for like five or six years or something. It's weird. It's like a blur like you know like almost in February we'll be open for 23 years. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know where we lie like in in like as far as shops being older or not in Las Vegas.

Like I got to look that up sometime. 23 years old. I don't think there's many that are especially consistent with same owner, you know. Same owner, same name, you know. Yeah. There's only a handful of shops I got more time than that. Yeah. which doesn't work.

That just means they're closing as soon as their lease is up, unfortunately. You know, if somebody says they're selling their shop, they're gonna get a little bit of money from somebody else that doesn't know what they're doing. And then Yeah. And nobody has that money right now. Yeah. No tattooers have that money right now. So, and if they do, they want to do their own thing, you know? We've been through this before hundred times with tattooing though.

I mean, if you've been doing it long enough, you've been I kind of like uh I don't know if you like I kind of like compare it to when I was young like and watching documentaries about skateboarding, you know, like watching skateboarding go through its peaks and its valleys. Like I think we're definitely going through an interesting valley. This is definitely the longest recession we've ever seen in tattooing. This is definitely the longest one. I think it's I don't know if it's just the I mean there's so many things against us right now. I mean, when you take it into consideration, like it's not just the recession that we're dealing with. We're dealing with more tattooers than we've ever dealt with in in the history of tattooing. We're dealing with a smaller minimum than we've ever dealt with in the history of tattooing.

Whereas 10 years ago, the average size tattoo was a palm size with color. These days, it's an outline that's big. It's minimum priced. And and now starting to see so many tattooers dropping their minimums, and it's like, how do you keep up with that? Yeah. Experience. experience. You got to give them experience.

You got to give them like something to talk about when they leave that's different from what other shops are doing. You know, we're looking I was looking at like our profit loss steam today and our costs are up higher than ever, you know, especially I mean even compared to last year, they're up higher, but the volume and the amount of people that are coming in through the door is is substantially less, you know. Yeah. Tattoos that they're getting are so much smaller. Yeah. And I I talked to like a lot of other tattooers that have been in the industry for a long time and they're and they're going through the exact same thing. Like people that you you see and you may still see as legends, not not discrediting them, they're they're just struggling too.

Like, you know, like that's the other thing with this recession is I feel in the past we went through geographic recessions where we'd be hurting here in the United States, but I talked to tattooers in in Europe and they're like, "Oh, no, we haven't felt," you know, and now this is the first time where no matter where you are in the tattoo industry, you're definitely feeling a bite. I think this is the first um worldwide tattoo recession that we've gone through. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Literally. Yeah. the old doc's uh wife's from Poland.

They're doing great. Okay. That's really ironic because I met these tattooers in New York when I did u uh on um John's podcast on tattooer out there and uh that I've been in contact with them and they're now like starting tattoo supply companies. " Okay, that's interesting. Tattooers that have been tattooing over 20 years are fine. Kind of. I don't know. It depends on their their mentality because you got to remember like you take into consideration the fact that every year has been a downgrade for me coming from the '9s.

I mean there was times where on an average day I do no less than a dozen tattoos. Coming to the 2000s now you're talking about three or four maybe five tattoos a day. Now at this stage in the game where it's like if you're lucky you're doing two tattoos. I feel like it's hurt the older generations more. the generations that were padded by all of this. Now, again, back to the, you know, the the the volume of tattooers. That's another another thing. When I came up, there were 24 tattooers in New York City.

You know, now there's 24 tattooers on every block in New York City. So, I feel like the older generation of tattooers are definitely getting hurt more than than the the generations after them. Yeah. Well, I feel like I mean I stay pretty consistent because I have a group of people that I tattoo like on a rotating basis, right? And it's a I don't know how many of them are off the top of my head, but I see the same people. It's like pretty rare that I tattoo somebody I don't know. And you kind of focus on smaller tattoos, too. Like you're you're not Yeah.

You're not trying to [ __ ] with like back pieces and full piece. So, you're still kind of like at an affordable, approachable kind of like I have actually I have a new back piece and I have a new sleeve, which is different for me, too. But I I like I try to keep my tattoos like CD size or smaller, you know? I like to have that visit and that interaction and have a good one, man. I don't want to hurt you. I don't want to hurt you for hours out. I don't want to run out of [ __ ] to talk about. Yeah.

You got three hours and then it's like, all right, I'm out. Age thing, you know, like leaning over somebody, your back hurts, dude. Or like I had a lot of problems with my feet ever since I ran those marathons, man. I got a lot of Are you not running any longer? I can't, man. I literally can't walk farther than like a couple miles right now. Really? Yeah.

I got this numbness in my legs. It might be a spine thing. Older weird weird things are happening. Get back into that yoga. I would love to go to yoga, man. Yeah. Got it, dude. It's like the only thing that I can think that that's helped me.

You're still going weekly? Yeah, I'm like doing like three to I try to do four days a week, but I usually get two to four. I'm like your neighbor. I should just go wherever you're at, dude. I don't live far from you at all. It was [ __ ] packed today. I did I did a hot yoga class this morning and it was like there was toe to toe, dude. Like I I go 9:30 in the morning.

9:30 is a great time. Drop the kids off, go straight there. That's a great time to go. I'm going to link up with you, man. I really I I really need to get But it helps my feet. It helps my neck, my back, like all those, you know, not not even just tattooing. Like my whole entire life I've been hunched over a drawing table. So it's like there was like a lot of years before that.

Yeah. That teenager just hunched over a drawing table. Yeah. Hella lonely. Like never had a girlfriend. Like I just drew in my room alone on a Friday night. But now there was like a solid decade where you were doing all the marathons and everything, right? I did it for 2017 to just a couple years ago, right?

2017. Yeah. To just a few years ago. I did 10 full marathons. Not hardly anybody. And you did all the major marathons, too. Three New York cities in a row. Three years in a row.

I did New York City. I did Chicago. I did Phoenix. I did Honolulu. I did two in Vegas. I have to ask Nick the other ones, but I did eight with Nick, I think. I think I did eight or nine with Nick. So, me and Nick got to run New York City together, and it was probably like the best time we ever had.

Yeah. So, my fastest one took me just under four hours. It was like 3 hours, 45 minutes for full 26 miles. That's fast. And my slowest one was 7 miles. So, that was the second one I did. So New York City was 3:55, Honolulu was 3 hours 45 minutes. I was clocking like a 6 minute 630 mile or something.

Wow. I was hauling and I had never I was never athlete my whole life. Ever. Ever. That was the first time I did anything athletic in my life. And And you were good at it? I was good at it. And but I'm paying for it now.

I I definitely think Is Nick still running? He runs. He goes to the gym. Nick's a great at going to the gym. He's there like five days, six days a week. Nick's interview is great, dude. talking about the ultramarathons and all the weird [ __ ] you know, running into the bushes and [ __ ] and then wip finishing a marathon with one sock on. I was like, he had some jokes.

" Me and Nick have been a few marathons. When he's got to go, he's got to go, you know? So, like, dude, you better go then, man. I'll wait for you right here, you know? Yeah. We had some great I mean, me and Nick have been out there, you know. You're talking, you're hanging out talking for like five hours, you know, while you're running a couple times. raining on us for like an hour straight.

You know, you hang out a lot and then you get to like mile 18, you're like, "Damn, dude. " Ran from the cops once and the worst block. Yeah. Yeah. I was hiding under a bridge for a minute. I got caught red-handed spray painting on these walls and I just [ __ ] dipped and I ended up on the other side of the city like I was [ __ ] hiding. Yeah. We We all got a few of those stories.

I mean, yeah. Yeah. coming home smelling like spray paint and all that. That was the only time I've ever done any Well, that's another thing. You You were big into graffiti before you got into tattoo. Loved graffiti. I love graffiti. Your whole style was full on new school.

It was full new school graffiti style when I first started. It's all I was interested in. I had all like graffiti magazines and I I was into it, man. I I I like I still like it. I still see I see it out there, you know, on the streets and I always go, "Good job, guys. " You know, you know, I didn't do it or anything, but I still love seeing it. I guess. Yeah.

Yeah. Did you have a tag before Swarm? I don't think so. I think I Oh, yeah. I think it was like I wanted to do evil or evil or something like that, but there was another dude in the city that had the same name. Yeah. Where did the swarm thing come from, man? The whole obsession with bees and the hive tattoo shop and everything, you know.

That's a fun story. The swarm thing actually came from the graffiti thing. So I was doing the swarm thing, everybody started calling me swarm, and then my dad actually started calling me swarm. Oh, really? Just from everybody calling me swarm. It's the best, dude. I got hit I got hit with a good one, dude. Yeah.

So he started calling me swarm and I was like I don't know 19 or 20 and then it just stuck and then and I was just like well if my dad can call me swarm and you you can call me swarm, you know. Just everybody calls me swarm. I don't even think I have an obsession with bees or anything. It just No, you just the honeycomb started going with it and yeah, it was like when I was about to open the shop, Jen's like, you know, you have to call it hive. There's just there's no other thing you can call it. It like swarms hive tattoo. I was like, yeah, you're right. I have to do that.

So, and then people started like giving me all this honeycomb and hive stuff. Like I have all this stuff hive now that's got all this Yeah, your whole throat's hived. I was literally too like ago I was like yeah 19 years old when I got that put on me I think. Yeah. And but way back bad apple you were there too, right? during that time I was. Yeah. Yeah.

So that's kind of it all it all stemmed from graffiti cuz I always liked to draw when I was a kid. Yeah. I just loved drawing and then it was like now you got this book that's black book and you just could fill it up with all these colored markers and even when I was just doing piercing like when we talked about I was down on Fremont I was always doing tags in this book. Always. Always. Yeah. Then I found spray paint to be like way too expensive dude. So yeah steal it and I was like I can't be doing this.

I didn't want to get in trouble, dude. Like I saw a few people get in trouble and they had to go back and pay all that money and I was like, I don't think Oh, yeah. Oscar Goodman was hardcore. He did not like it. I forget. Good chance on here, too. And he was telling a story about his house getting [ __ ] raided. Yeah.

And pulled out for graffiti stuff for spray paint. Really? They pulled his ass out of bed [ __ ] like boom, just in the middle of the night. Yeah. My first house had graffiti all along all the walls in the backyard. I bought my first house when I was like 22 or something like that. " I'd be like, "I don't know. " You know, yes, I did.

Yeah, I used to have some good parties, dude. Yeah. I wish I could remember all those. I wish I had pictures from all those, you know. Thousand good times, man. Thousand good times. Uh yeah, those parties were great, dude. Yeah, I think you came to one, I think.

Maybe. I don't know. You had some good parties, dude. You had great parties. I mean, we partied. We definitely partied. Yeah. I flipped a Corolla over in my backyard and it lit on fire.

And I wasn't driving. Oh man. Yeah, we had some good ones. It is what it is. I see I see Shawn once in a while. Yeah. He tells me about some of that. Actually saw the Frost Brothers pretty recently.

Used to do it. You know who's been coming around getting tattooed is uh Weston. Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah. He's been coming around getting a few tattoos here and there. Oh, good. He's always got some cool not too long ago in Oh, that's right.

Yeah. Yeah. I like all those people, too. All All good people, man. A lot of old schoolers. Yeah. Now, have have your kids picked up art? Are your kids artistically savvy?

Oh, we should ask her over there. She's sitting over there. She's She's She's actually recently picked up the guitar. Really? Yeah, she Yeah. But, uh, Mimi is quite the artist. She's like in ceramics and she made me a ticky mug for my birthday. super cool.

So, not so much. She likes to draw. I've taught her how to use the iPad, but they're definitely crafty, I would say. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They'll find their creative outlet. Yeah.

Yeah. So far, those two are so far. So, I don't know what the little one's going to do yet besides raise hell, dude. She's an absolute animal, dude. She's absolutely crazy. My my tiny one, dude. She's like a pure she's a two. She's like a pure anarchist, man.

Like, she's just absolutely nuts, dude. No, not not a fear in the world, dude. Yeah, not a fear in the world. Doesn't want to learn how to talk. Just wants to throw [ __ ] at you. Like, I really got what I deserve finally. I think, you know, I really did. Three girls.

Three girls. Three. And then Jen has a girl. So, it's four. Four girls. All girls. Yeah. Yeah.

Like I said, all they do is clown on me now. You know, like it's like a whole clown on dad thing when you're in the in the kitchen or the living room. Did you get them at the shop ever? Like help? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Mimi's gotten really into piercings, so she's getting her ears all pierced up. She's got her belly pierced. She's wants She's got her nose pierced. This one's starting to get curious. " So, it's kind of cool cuz I was into it when I was young. Me and and uh their uncle were really into piercings when we were young. Always into piercing for some reason. Yeah.

I never was. Yeah. I got my ear pierced in fourth grade and then I got a big gas kloid that grew out the back of my ear and was super embarrassed. had to get that thing sawed off and then I just never went back to piercing. Yeah, that makes sense. It wasn't for everybody. I think I got my tongue pierced when I was like 17 or 16. And I remember my dad coming home and like having his eyebrow pierced or some [ __ ] I can't imagine your dad with an eyebrow piercing.

Oh my god. " Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. That's wild, man. Yeah, it was. I don't know. How are your parents?

Well, how's your mom? Yeah, good. We just, you know, just great. They're, you know, just doing doing it, doing it. Yeah. No. Yeah. We keep them, we keep them keep the kids busy, too, you know.

So, they're like always with us or they'll be over here like on a Saturday like writing cards to people and like, you know, I get them to draw dinosaurs on the cards and we put them in every order and stuff, you know. Yeah. We keep them busy. It's good. So, [ __ ] I don't know, man. I think we should We covered some bases, man. So, yeah, we we went off on There's always the reunion episode. There's always the reunion episode.

The dick, man. But it's just like it's crude. Crude. I find myself crude as I get older just cuz like I never really It was wild. My whole upbringing was so wild, man. It's just like there's no You can't really cut it down. You can't You can't baby it, you know? It's good times, wild times.

And I I think tattooing my outlook on tattooing right now is really different from a lot of people I talk to, man. I It's still good. I It's still great. I know it's slow for a lot of people, but for me, it's pretty good. And some of the people that work for me, it's great for them. They do different styles and have their own group of people that they tattoo. And then I think once you make that tribe of people, I mean, they just stay getting tattooed from you. Their family members get tattooed from you.

And I think I think that's important for young tattooers to learn is to Are you seeing are you tattooing their kids? Are you Is it a generational Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm starting to tattoo their kids. I think I'm not far away from tattooing their kids' kids. I'm only like seven or eight years or something like that. Yeah, I'm almost there.

It's like I know there's one of my clients it's like getting close where it's like scary. I am getting the Yeah. the random like, "Oh, come on. I know you're not tattooing a whole lot lately, but like, you know, my so and so wants this, you know, and I was like, you got to do it, man. I know. You got to do it. It's a It's like a what? I haven't It's like a legacy thing for for a lot of people, especially if you've known them for a long time, you know?

Yeah, it is. It's not about you, you know? It's about them and their stories and the and the and how grateful are you to have these people that want to be there? Yeah. every single person that sits down, man, I'm grateful that you took the time out of your day and you sat with me and we did a tattoo and we had fun, you know, and that's as far as a tattoo goes for me. It's it's a lot of fun. Yeah. You know, it's it's fun.

We're not saving people's lives, but you know, still making people look kind of Yeah, actually. Sometimes, you know, depend. And there are those people whose lives we have saved, you know. Yeah. We we all remember those first tattoos. You couldn't you couldn't walk past the mirror. All of a sudden, you've just felt like an amazing human being. It has that that's the magic of this tattoo [ __ ] is it can bring you from down here to all the way up here and a 15minute tattoo.

You still see it, man. " Yeah. I know. It helped us out, you know. Oh, yeah. And and I feel like we we get just as much out of that when you see that customer smiling in the mirror thrilled. It does something for you. It gives you that that that that uh what's the word I'm looking for?

Just confidence and and and stoked, you know? You're just like pumped on it, dude. " I did NYX back. I did NYX back. You can't see it. You can't see. Just do the shoulders. What?

What? You can see that's put a quarter of the top of a rose. Right. Looks funny in that yoga mirror. Huh? Yeah. I just keep my shirt on. I got a few more I need to get, I'm sure.

And then like she was saying earlier, the kids want to do like little tattoos on me. So, I'm going to do that at some point, you know? Yeah. My wife tattooed me the other day like right on my [ __ ] hand, which trip out. I see hand tattoos on this guy. No, I know cuz dude, all my whole career I didn't do nothing above the collar or below the wrist. Yeah. " You know?

When your dad was so mad at me when I got my head tattooed, dude. Yeah. He did not like that. I remember that. Thought I scared away the first customer and he came and I was just like, I don't know. Austin said it was fine, man. I don't know. I had to talk him out of getting [ __ ] bacon and eggs tattooed on his head.

Brilliant. Can you imagine if it like there's so many times I had to talk him out of doing something? No. But it's wild how far that has gone cuz like at the nationals conventions in the '9s, they wouldn't let you in if you had facial tattoos. And these days, it's like what what tattooer doesn't have facial tattoos? It's so rare to run into a young tattooer that doesn't have [ __ ] all over their face. I mean, my barista has more facial tattoos than most tattooers I know, you know? It's like, whoa.

I don't even notice it anymore. Like unless you have like a full-fledged like dagger down your nose, I don't even I don't even notice it. I don't think for the longest time that I've seen tattoos on tattooed people. I know that sounds weird, but it's like I get to know people and I don't even see your tattoos. Like I I know you have them. Has to be pretty out. Can you tell me what Can you tell me what so and so has on their arm? So now I've always wondered that about our kids.

Do our kids just not see tattoos because they're so used to seeing tattoos? My family, they don't know. My wife too, she'll say, she'll like, "I don't know what tattoos you have. " She can ask me like every tattoo I have, I can tell you who did it. I can tell you who did the conversations you had during it, how much you paid for it. You can tell everything. Everything. every I remember where I was living at that time or who was with me or who was sitting with me.

Now, back to that's what weirds me out when I say to somebody who did your tattoo and they're like some guy. " Yeah. Like that's the you're missing all the fun, right? Or even us remembering our clients. Like there's a lot of times where I don't remember a name or maybe sometimes don't a face cuz I see the tattoo. You see the tattoo and then you're instantly like you're a barber, you [ __ ] Yeah. Your mom did this. I [ __ ] remember it all cuz it it is cuz I spent that time% I I I have I have a bad habit of not looking people in their face to begin with.

But when I'm like this the whole time. Yeah. Yeah. They just listen. They know everything about me. They know where every weird hair is on my face cuz they're staring right at me. But I'm just looking at the tattoo for 3 hours. " You know, you you just remember that one little thing.

You told me that like how are your 10 kids or you ever had anybody tell you about how they got tattooed by this guy named Swarm somewhere? Uh I've had that happen to me multiple times at a bar or whatever. So I I've had people do that for the shop so far. " I'm like, "Oh, really? " Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

" I'm like, "Yeah, I kind of own it. " But that's awesome you get tattooed there. Yeah. It's funny because I generally don't even bring it up. " Yeah, that's a good place, dude. Like, yeah. I don't know. I don't really leave the house without a piece of article of clothing promoting whatever I'm doing now.

But I know I should have wore some today. I feel very Yeah. Hive naked today, man. So, [ __ ] that's where we find you. Give us I'll be there. Yeah. Hive tatto. We got eight tattooers there.

My body piercer I was talking about earlier. which is phenomenal. You want to get your We have eight tattooers now. Good lord. We have eight actually people there from like 12:00 to 7:00 now. Every day it's actually on schedules. People are there which is totally opposite of how it was started and what I wanted to do. But like we were talking about earlier, things evolve and you have to do things to to keep it going, you know.

Yeah. But but you recently expanded too. I expanded. It's been two years now that I expanded because I wanted to have body piercing because so many people called me and that was a skill I possessed that I could teach somebody to do. So I said I can do this. I can. So yeah, I had to go through the city and cut holes in the walls and pull permits. I did the whole nine, which is a huge pain if you ever have to do that.

You probably know a little bit about that. But um I just wanted to have body piercing. So I had room to do body piercing over there and then have two more tattooers. And now it's turned into just one tattooer. And I think eventually it might just turn into just body piercing on that side. Like if you come into the shop, there's a comfortable place to sit and wait to get body pierced to like product on display and just like have respect towards that. And like those clients are there for a totally different situation. They don't need to be sitting in the middle of the tattoo shop, you know?

So I got like seven on one side and one on the other. There usually like two or three people there at a time. But I I'm really proud of the group of people that I've put together so far. Well, you're a good dude. You surround good yourself by you've always surrounded yourself by great people, you know. Yeah, I got a pretty big group still. Still see all those guys weekly. Always admiring that.

Yeah. Yeah. I have a huge group, you know. Um I'm going to do the anniversary party again this year on the first Saturday of May. That's the 5year anniversary party. And I think I'm going to not have a party for a while. I think I'm going to wait till like year eight and then maybe like year 10 or something because it's quite the It takes a lot out of me to throw those to this guy does three a week. We're doing them like once a month right now.

It's so crazy. Once a month, man. Are you nuts, bro? Like I like I I can appreciate it. We have a good team right now, though. Like everybody's like [ __ ] working their asses off all the time. Like that's that's what you need. Yeah.

Because for every like person you had there that was kind of sucked or was a jerk or whatever, there's somebody else that wants to come in and make it great. Dude, I just got a just just got a new great person this week. She starts on Friday. Just find the right people that like love your place and love what you do and the way you run it and and things will they they work out, you know. But like I said, I think I'm going to do this party the five year, take a little break cuz since Nick's hitting the road, I met Nick helps me with most of that stuff. We put that wall up every We put we put like a semi-permanent wall up for art every year. We have a huge art show. I think I sent out like 30 art invitations to be part of the show last year and I got like four pieces of art or something like that.

So hard. I literally have to like call people every week and be like, "Hey man, you said you were going to do this art show. " You got to guilt the [ __ ] out of them. Artists need to be guilted and whipped. Yeah. Like speaking of guilt guilt trip, I heard Mike didn't do the record. He did not. And it it was I you know, I'll give him a pass this year because I didn't reach out to him personally.

But uh yeah, it just I'll guilt him next year. This was great. It was great catching up. Thanks. Thanks for coming, dude. Thanks for having me on, man. I love you with all of my heart, dude. Love you, Phil.

Love you, homie. Ran into this guy, man. This guy's the best. Oh. Oh, we didn't even talk about I ran into you at the baseball game and we're sitting right [ __ ] next to each other. What are the odds? I know. That's right next to each other.

like same row and I was like this is awesome and then like I it was right after my wife left and I just drank that night bro like probably when I say goodbye to you I I don't really remember dude so it was a good game we lost but it was a good game great I love sporting events dude I always have I still I think I go to like 18 nights games a year and a sportsman I never knew a damn thing about sports bro you have to see my living room now I got We got to have you guys buy, dude. It's pretty impressive, dude. I got 275 in mounted. I got 55 mounted on the fireplace. I got the YouTube TV hit c hooked up package. You've always been a very Vegas sports team guy. Are you going to be an A's guy? I have a hard time with the A's cuz the A's are in the same division as the Angels.

Like my mortal enemy for years. I went to an Angels game with you. We had a good time. Yeah, we had a great time. Yeah. Yeah. We left in an ambulance. Not you, but me and uh their mom, the girl's mom.

I don't I remember that. Yeah, remember? Had to leave in an ambulance. I left Angel St in an ambulance that night. Who was I with? Oh, it was with Andy or something. Oh, okay. Okay.

I was with the girl's mom and uh we went to that when we had that beach house and then we ended up leaving an ambulance that night and we went to the hospital, right? And then we came back to the beach house and they didn't know what was wrong with her and we turned out we came back home and she was pregnant with Michaela. Michaela. Oh man. Yeah. See, I found out my wife and I she was pregnant in uh Newport Beach, too. That's the same. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I was eating that [ __ ] $8 mega piece of pizza by myself, super drunk in the middle of the [ __ ] pizza place, and she comes in crying with this stick. And I was like, "What is that? What is that? " So, why are you crying? I'm just mowing this pizza hammered in the middle of the day. Yeah.

The girl's mom had gotten so sick at that Angels game and they didn't know. She was like, "I don't know. " And then they like, they put me in an Angel Stadium cage. Like all the players were walking by and I was like, "This is so weird. " I think you guys just took off and next thing you know, I'm riding the ambulance and we're like sitting in. We were all staying in the same house, right? Okay. Yeah.

" Like like we got to go, you know? And we left. I think I Ubered. I mean, that was 16 years ago now. Like time flies. So, at least you get to see the A's here in Vegas because they're in the same division. They'll play a couple of times a year. Correct.

Well, my retirement plan always. I love this. Always. Are you going to do all of them? I was going to be a a baseball usher. Oh, brilliant. My whole retirement plan ever was I just wanted to be an old ass man. I was forced to go to the baseball stadium, you know, 40 something time or 80 something times.

I would tell my whole family like, "Oh, no. I can't go to that birthday party. I have to I have to work tonight, you know, and I want to go and I want to show people to their seats and I want to stand there and watch the baseball game. " So, my dreams may come true cuz there's there's one here. I'm excited to see this new stadium. From the what I'm seeing, it looks phenomenal, guys. It's beautiful, dude. It's beautiful.

Like I said, man, I got the YouTube TV. I watch all nine morning NFL games at one time. Oh my god. Yeah, bro. And then some days I'll have like hockey, baseball, you know, whatever whatever's going on, you know. I got them all on, dude. I'm just sitting there. I might have to bring Gray over because he wants to learn all the sports and I don't know a thing at all.

We got to get him and Luca together because that's all Luca does all day long. He's in the backyard playing basketball, playing soccer all day long. Yeah, he's in basketball and soccer now at school. So, it's fun. Phil, where do we find you at? Thanks for hanging with us. I'm on Instagram. I'm on Instagram.

Phil Luck tattoo for some strange [ __ ] reason. That's it. That's the only place to find Unless you're on my block and you walk past my garage. Oh, man. Phil still in the garage. Don't leave the garage. That's good. He's a garage master, man.

That's it. Well, thank you guys so much for hanging out tonight. Thanks for listening. Always fun. and the reunion. We got to start putting together this reunion. Okay. That's man, if you can get like all of us there, man, I think that would be a lot of fun to talk about.

Coming on next. Oh, good. Good. Yeah, he's doing great. Oh, right on. Very cool. Very cool. I haven't I don't have a date yet, so he's doing great, man.

He's doing the sober thing and he's doing the comedy thing. We went to one of his shows. We had a great time. Did you? Yeah, we need to go. I I was just uh on the way over here in November 16th. He's doing one, but I think I'm I think that's a night of I think we have a party or something. Everything that comes out of his [ __ ] mouth is funny.

Everything that comes out of Yeah. He's found a little niche, dude. And I I think he's going to be do well at it, man. So, I'm proud of him, too. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. You got to get everybody got to get everybody over here.

Yep. Yeah. I'm down, dudes. But, uh, [ __ ] it. Let's wrap it up. We got to go pick up kids and do stuff. Right on. Yeah, we'll leave work tomorrow again and I'm gonna go see the insane clown posy tomorrow night.

Oh my goodness. I'm not in Vegas. They're playing. Yeah. I'm not a fan, but I just I just want to do something weird. I just like want to show up and I know the guy who runs Brooklyn Bowl. So, we're going to be like me and Will are going to go. We're going to be like on a lane and drink some beers and awesome laugh.

Drink some fo. I hope so. I hope so. The Aquabats play Friday night. I'm trying to Oh, that's your That's your man. I know, dude. I love concerts, man. Love it.

I love punk rock bowling. I love concerts. I had breakfast next to Fat Mike the other day. Did you really? Does he live in town? It was just him and I and he was talking to some girl and I was like I was just stare. He sat down at the table that was like right in front of me and I was like I look so famili I'm like oh I mean I kind of knew who it was right off the bat but then after I listened to him talk I was like oh okay I was just by myself eating breakfast just awkwardly like out there with him. the coolest week weekend not too long ago like Pennywise and Sublime played with the singer Sun.

Yeah. And I bought tickets to both nights. They played double nights at um Park MGM. So I went to the first night and I happened to be walking by on the record. You've been inside of there. On the record. I feel like you like the inside of there. And he was doing a popup acoustic show, The Sun, like Bradley No's son, Jacob.

And it was awesome. And it got me really excited to see the show at night. He sounds just like his dad. He killed it. It was an acoustic set. He killed it. I took a picture with him. He was so nice.

So that night I got to see that show with Penny Wise. Lead singer from Penny Wise was doing private tour punk rock museum the next day. I went to that. It was only about like 30 of us and he told us all these great stories and then I went and saw that show that night and it was just awesome. Like the best two days ever, man. It was so much fun, dude. So much fun. Right down Swarm's alley, dude.

Right down. Right down, dude. Yeah, I always be that old dude in the back, dude. " Well, damn, guys. Let's uh shut her down. Thank you guys so much for tuning in. Um yeah, keep uh keep uh keep uh keep keep coming back. I don't know.

What are you supposed to say? Subscribe and comment below or something like that. I don't I haven't done any of those things. Yeah. What are we supposed to say? Subscribe and comment below. I don't know. Hit the thumb.

Yeah, I never really done any of that [ __ ] So anyway, thanks everybody. Peace. Brought to you by Maverick Supply Co. Boy.